Building A Life That Matters | Brian Dubow (Hit of Happiness) | Better Man Podcast Ep. 163

Dean Pohlman: Hey guys. It’s Dean. Welcome to the Better Man podcast. Today’s episode features an interview with Brian Dubow of Hit of Happiness. And in this episode, we’re going to talk about building lives that matter. We really focus on Brian’s own personal journey in this, how he had a very successful job, how he was made by his peers. But he realized deep down that when he asked himself the right questions, when he had the opportunity to actually check in with himself, he realized he wasn’t really happy and he didn’t really care about his job.

Dean Pohlman: So in this episode, we talk about some questions that you can ask yourself to determine if you’re happy or not, to, just go on this path of improving your life and being more aligned with who you are as a person. We talk about how happiness is an inside job. This is a concept that I really like, that we go into a little bit more and, we talk about some of just the thought process and the introspection that is involved in starting to assess for yourself, hey, how do I make myself happier?

Dean Pohlman: How do I live a life that is more aligned with who I am and what I really want out of life? So I hope you enjoyed this episode. I think it does a great job of exemplifying everything that we try to do with the betterment podcast in general, and improving men’s health overall, and I hope it inspires you to be a better man.

Dean Pohlman: Hey guys. It’s seen. Welcome to the Betterment podcast. Today I’ve got Brian Daybell from Head of Happiness, and we’re going to be talking about his journey from a boring corporate job. Soul sucking corporate. I don’t know if it actually was soul sucking, but into what you’re doing now with Head of Happiness. So, Brian, thanks for joining me.

Brian Dubow: Thanks for having me. Dan. It’s great to be here.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, I always like to start off the episodes with dramatic and probably incorrect introductory statements that I later have to correct myself on. But yeah. Anyways, so, Brian, how are we were connected through a, I think it was a member. I think it was a mental yoga member who was also familiar with. Was he a client of yours, or was he, familiar with your work?

Brian Dubow: Yeah. So he was familiar with work. He’s he’s, followed me for a bit as well. So he saw the interlock between what I was doing, like you were doing. And he said, I need to connect you guys.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. And I’ve. You know, I can tell from the the couple of conversations that we had that we’re definitely on the same frequency in terms of men’s wellness. In terms of being a bit more introspective about life and what we want out of it and, you know, all that stuff, which is cool, because how marami how old you are.

Brian Dubow: I’m 31. What about you? 31.

Dean Pohlman: I’m 35. Wait, no, in 36. 36, I know I did after like 27. I’m just like in my 27 or 20:08 a.m., I like 30 or 30? I have no idea. Yeah. My metabolic age is 27. According to my according to my Hume Health scale.

Brian Dubow: That’s the only age that matters. Let’s be honest. Yes, that in your listening age on your Spotify wrapped. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: Which I’m, I’m I’m 60 on Spotify rap. So a lot of.

Brian Dubow: Classic rock.

Dean Pohlman: Got a lot of. Yeah I listen to the Rocky Rocky four soundtrack for a lot of my workouts last year. So, you know, that’s like. Yeah, you’re you’re an old man. I’m cool. That’s fine. I’ve seen a lot of guys in their 50s, 60s, and even in their 70s who are crushing their workouts and still doing great.

Dean Pohlman: So, like, I’m fine. I’m fine with that.

Brian Dubow: Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: But anyways, So. Yeah, you you started this whole journey, you know, based on you started this whole, you know, kind of happiness journey with your own experience being in, you know, traditional call it a traditional job. And, you went through all the stuff and started doing this. So, like, let’s go back to the beginning and just kind of tell me your story.

Brian Dubow: Yeah. So as you mentioned, I have a business called Head of Happiness now, which is, you know, happiness coaching, life coaching, business coaching. I really it’s, I mean, helping people build lives that matter. I also teach a class at UCLA. But obviously, you know, growing up, I didn’t say I want to be a happiness coach. Growing up, I was buried in the box.

Brian Dubow: I came from a family who said, you know, Brian, you’re going to be a doctor, a lawyer or an accountant. I got to college and, you know, there was about a great accounting program. I went to University of Florida and my dad was an accountant. I was like, all right, I’m good with numbers. Let’s just make sense.

Brian Dubow: And I think that was a theme for a lot of my life. This makes sense, as opposed to really asking myself, what do I want? You know? And I wish that self-awareness was something that we were taught in middle school and high school. As opposed to just chasing a, you know, a some definition of success that isn’t our own.

Brian Dubow: And, you know, even in college, I felt like I was good at what I was doing, but that doesn’t mean I enjoyed it. It was always like, oh, yeah, I’ll do this for a couple of years, and then I’ll figure out my life. And I even remember walking into the office, you know, academics and being like, you know, I think I’m picking up, I want to pick up a minor, maybe in something like philosophy because I knew myself.

Brian Dubow: Like, those are the conversations I like to have. And that’s why you and I get along. We love talking about the meaning of life and figuring out, you know, how to make this thing count. But, you know, I walked out of my guidance counselors office with a minor in actuarial science. And for those of you don’t know, that’s like the an insurance person who calculates the likelihood of someone dying and therefore I can figure out what to charge people, you know, crazy stats.

Brian Dubow: And it’s like, I know that’s not what I wanted, but I was convinced that that pairs very well with an accounting major and makes sense, you know, so I was continue just I also how’s the.

Dean Pohlman: Life insurance market these.

Brian Dubow: Days. You know I wish I knew honestly, it was probably probably interesting during Covid in the beginning. But you know, I, I did this, I got I allowed people to push me and tell me what I wanted as opposed to listening to my intuition. And that being said, I was succeeding by by, you know, everyone’s standards and staying on the path.

Brian Dubow: I got a job with, one of the big four accounting firms in New York City. Deals, consulting. I found myself in my early 20s in rooms of CFOs and CEOs of fortune 500 companies, early promoted. You know, I found myself making more money than most of my friends and getting, you know, on my limited time off, going on sick trips to Europe or wherever I wanted Southeast Asia.

Brian Dubow: So I had achieved what I thought was success, you know, great money, early promotions, parents who are super proud of me, social media of me, traveling all over, living the dream, staying in nice hotels and, you know, having fancy meals. But when I got honest with myself, when I got quiet myself with myself, which I was avoiding, that’s why I was that’s probably part of why I was keeping myself busy, because I didn’t want to hear my intuition and you and I.

Brian Dubow: But now workaholism is a way to avoid listening to our emotions, just like alcoholism and just like anything else. You know, when I got away from the 70 and 80 hour workweeks, I was just comfortably numb. Like I was going through the motions of life. I was looking around saying, like, I know if I do everything right for another 10 or 15 years, I’ll be a partner, but I don’t want their lives.

Brian Dubow: That’s not what excites me. You know, I’m someone who craves adventure. I’m someone who craves connection, who craves connection to self and others in meaningful ways. So I, I knew I was off track. I knew that I had achieved maybe society’s definition of happiness, but I had that realization that that definition of happiness was not my definition of happiness.

Brian Dubow: And I knew I wanted to define that for myself, because if I didn’t, I didn’t. I would regret that. I, you know, I think one of my biggest fears in life is not living up to my potential, my potential of what life can be. And I knew that I this wasn’t the domain that I wanted to seek my potential in.

Brian Dubow: And so that kind of set me on my first journey. I call that like my quarter life crisis in my 20s where I was like, okay, let me, let me like draw a line in the sand. I will not be doing this two years from now. This is it. Two years of exploration to figure out what is my next path, what is my next track?

Brian Dubow: And I hired my first career coach or life coach who is super helpful and really forcing me to sit with the questions that I avoid through workaholism habits. And I started having coffee chats with people living lives in interesting ways. So people like you, Dean, you know, I, I sat with entrepreneurs, I sat with executives, I sat with artists, I sat with athletes.

Brian Dubow: Even you know, all the just people who had gotten off the path and found their own path. Most path. And those conversations inspired me. Some of them gave me hints of like, I think I have a little bit of that inside me. And I’ve learned that when someone inspires you, it’s because you have a version of that done within you.

Brian Dubow: Something about the way they’re living their lives. I have that in me. You know, when I see an inspirational speaker, it’s like, oh, I can do that too. And now that is a part of my job. So I was getting inspired by certain people paying attention to who energizes me, who depleted me. And there was one coffee chat, with a professor at Harvard.

Brian Dubow: His name was Doctor Tall. Ben Shahar is one of the lead thinkers on the science of happiness and he tie, at the time, the most popular class at Harvard on happiness. And this was before happiness was cool before Covid. And, you know, now people actually talk about happiness. But before then it was and that wasn’t a topic of conversation.

Brian Dubow: And, you know, I got coffee with him and I’d be 15 minutes. It turned into like two hours. By the end of it, I was like, whatever Kool-Aid this guy’s drinking, I want to drink that Kool-Aid, too. So I spent the next year studying under him to become a certified happiness trainer and coach. And now is a deep dive into the science of happiness, learning what actually makes us happy versus what we think makes us happy.

Brian Dubow: And it was never like, I’m going to build a career out of happiness. It was really just me following my curiosity and being like, this feels like something that would be valuable in my journey to make life count. And a year later, I’d say while still working the same job, my happiness went from something like a three out of ten to an eight out of ten, with a major takeaway for me being happiness is an inside job, and that we give so much credit to our external environment and say, when I get the next promotion, I’ll be happier.

Brian Dubow: When I get married, I’ll be happier when I get that house with the white picket fence, then I will actually be happy. And that’s true for about a week. And then we go searching again. So none of those things actually make it. What makes us happy is fall in love with our day to day life, and taking actions to do the things that actually make us happy and enjoying the time.

Brian Dubow: And so I saw a shift in my life and I was like, if this can work for me, why can’t this work for other people? And that was the beginning of a me starting to coach on the side. B when Covid started, I started putting out content on happiness and blogging and podcasting, and that started trending a little bit socially.

Brian Dubow: When people and you may remember, in the beginning of Covid, people were spending a ton of time on social media and they didn’t know what to do with their time. And I try to reframe this time as like, genius time. You know, a lot of great things come out of these, these moments where the world stops while there’s the 2008 financial crisis or whatever else.

Brian Dubow: So kind of use this time to pause, reflect, and think about where you want to be. And I’m grateful for that time. And then I also spent a year, in H.R. At PBC switching to human capital strategy, focus on how do we motivate and retain our employees and, and that year, I got to build a business case for happiness in the workplace this hour, leading workshops.

Brian Dubow: And really an eye opening moment for me was when I was given the green light to lead a workshop for the New York market. In the past, we had done workshops on like mindfulness and maybe 100 people show up. The first workshop, unhappiness, 2200 people show up, 2200 people simply because of the word happiness. There’s something about that word, but it’s people in the door that makes people say, you know, I want that.

Brian Dubow: Even though with mindfulness, which is a is a close cousin, people say, yeah, that’s for hippies and roads. That’s not me. You know? So that was kind of my moment of, you know, this can work. I see why can’t this work anywhere? And at that point I lost my job. I and I built a business while getting an MBA.

Brian Dubow: And here I am on the other side where I do one on one coaching. And I’m happy to get into, like, what that journey actually looks like so our listeners can kind of hear it. I teach at UCLA. The class is called alive, and that’s all about helping people figure out what makes them really feel alive.

Brian Dubow: You know, what is success? See? What are your values or your superpowers? What are your limiting beliefs? And then, keynote speaking and experiences. So I just went on a rant. I’ll stop for a second and breathe.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. So, so a couple of things. So first off, I just want to kind of bring up the, the theme that, that, that I’ve also, you know, spend a lot of my time thinking about is kind of how you’re just, you’re kind of just subconsciously programed into a lot of these things. And I just grow up being subconsciously programed to, you know, to put values on certain things.

Dean Pohlman: And, you know, subconsciously programed sounds like this sinister thing that’s happening. And I don’t I don’t really look at it. It’s that I think it’s just like, well, this is just what humans are naturally drawn towards. I mean, humans just look to we look, you perceive, we look to power, we look to money. That’s just like, okay, humans are naturally drawn to because we think that those things are going to make us happy.

Dean Pohlman: And so unless you have somebody or something or you’re part of a group or there’s, you know, there’s there are ideas, there’s some forces that are steering you to focus on different values than you are naturally. Just going to kind of go to there’s these things that, that don’t ultimately make you happy, but things that, you know, we think will make us happy.

Dean Pohlman: So, you know, I can see a lot of that in my own life. Like, you know, I thought like, okay, well, I just need to if I look really good in the mirror and if I have a successful business and, you know, I, you know, I get the wife, I get the house, I get status, or I just, like, I look like I’m successful.

Dean Pohlman: Cool. And I’m going to be happy, you know, and then you realize like, oh, wow. Okay. There’s still some work to do here. So I think that’s first thing that I just wanted to point out because I think that, you know, I think that resonates a lot with your story. And then the second thing I want to go to is I want to go back to some of those questions that your initial life coach was asking you, because I think these are the questions that, you know, most of us need to be asking, and maybe we’re just not sure of how to how to what those questions are or how to do

Dean Pohlman: them, or maybe the right environment to in which to do them. But I think it’s important that, you know, people call out, carve out the time to be able to do that. And like, you know, it’s different for me, obviously, because I do have like a nontraditional lifestyle. You know, there are times that I’m working, you know, nonstop.

Dean Pohlman: And like, all I can think about is manual yoga. But then there are times and I’m like, mom. Yeah. I’m like, you know, maybe it’s only like four, four hours a day. Maybe I do, like, maybe I work in the morning and in the afternoon, and I’m like, thinking about other stuff. So having having kind of a creative job allows me to it allows me to have more space, I think, to think about things.

Dean Pohlman: And so a lot of these questions that, you know, I ask myself or that I’ve just been exposed to just because I am in this world of self-development, I don’t think everyone else gets the chance to to be exposed to those questions. So. So yeah, I’d like to go back to you like, what are some of those questions that you were initially opposed that started you, you know, rethinking how you approach life?

Brian Dubow: The great question and thank you for your share. The question that I that really sticks out to me and I asked myself this question once every two weeks and I journaling sessions is, what am I pretending not to know right now in life? What am I pretending not to know? And we pretend not to know things because it’s easier.

Brian Dubow: Pretend not to know that I’m in out in the wrong city. Because then I’ll. I’ll have to, you know, pack up, move, find a new place. But easier to just pretend not to know and then actually confront that. Pretend not to know that I’m in the wrong job, because otherwise I have to quit and I have to find a new job.

Brian Dubow: And it’s a tough job market. Pretend not to know that I’m in the wrong relationship. You know, whatever it is for you. We all pretend not to know things because it’s easier and we don’t have to deal with confrontation. But by acknowledging the things we are pretending not to know, which is us tapping into our intuition, those little hunches we have.

Brian Dubow: I know I need to make a shift, but I don’t want to right now. That to me is a major major. Not just at first acknowledging that and taking action as a major way to get closer to the life we are meant to live. Because when our when we listen to our intuition, when we take action on it, we find ease.

Brian Dubow: We find peace like disease. The concept of this disease, or whatever that disease is, is not being at ease, dis ease with ourselves and with our lives. So create being honest with ourselves and making the chefs gets us so place of ease gets us to being healthy, happy and I think everything we the dream life. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: So like when you ask yourself that question, what were what were the things that came to light when you first started asking yourself this question?

Brian Dubow: I’m pretending not to know that, I’m not happy is probably the first one. I told myself, and I had a big smile on my face every day, and I’d walk into the office when I’d go out to the bar with people, I’d be like, yeah, I work a walk. And nothing wrong with that company. It’s a great company.

Brian Dubow: I just think I was in the wrong role. I want to caveat that, but I would. I would tell people it’s awesome. I get to go to all of these places. You know, I get to stay in these all the fancy hotels I get to, I get to do all this stop expense, all these meals.

Brian Dubow: I talk about it like it was the life. And I was pretending not to know that I was totally burned out. I crazy, I wish I had a 9 to 5 at that time. You know, I, I wish I had a greater sense of purpose, a greater sense of meeting. But I pretended not to know that because it was easier.

Brian Dubow: And society looked at me and was like, like Brian’s the man. He has the life, you know?

Dean Pohlman: No external validation that made it easier to put up with.

Brian Dubow: Way easier. Yeah. And, as long as I got the external validation from my friends and my parents. What did it matter what I felt inside? You know, I, I’m the type of person and this is something I still work on in therapy. Who would rather bottle up my own struggle than disappoint other people. I never want to be a burden for other people.

Brian Dubow: I’m I, I have my own people pleasing tendencies, so I would rather disappoint you. Feel disappointed myself than disappoint my parents.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, that’s that’s something that’s really interesting is the whole people pleasing concept, because initially I hear people talking about people pleasing. I heard it and I was like, oh, there’s no way I’m a people pleaser. And then like whenever I say like, oh, that’s not me, there’s this. The second part of me follows up as like, but is it?

Dean Pohlman: And then I’m like, oh, okay. So, you know, if you’re ever listening to, you know, some praise presentation or something and you’re like, oh, that’s definitely not me. Give it another shot. Yeah. But I have a question. Question for you going back to kind of just your, your experience with we talked about intuition and not listening to intuition.

Dean Pohlman: And I’m curious for you, as a kid growing up, do you think that you had a good sense of intuition, or did you learn not to listen to your intuition?

Brian Dubow: I think that I listened to my intuition until about 15 years old. I think, like if I look at myself right now, I’m pretty aligned. I, I’m pretty tapped into my intuition. I love getting in front of a group and inspiring them and giving a keynote and middle school. I was a thespian. I was, you know, the kid who was the lead in the middle school plays.

Brian Dubow: So it’s like I was that guy and I was allowed to be that guy and allowing myself to be that guy until I got to high school and then for some reason, a storyline kicked in. I was like, Brian, it’s time to take life seriously. I like, like the game is over. Like it’s now about like I’m on the treadmill.

Brian Dubow: It’s time to do everything I can to set myself up for success. Take as many dance placement classes as possible. Sign up for the sport that I can make varsity for as many years on it so it looks good. On the college application, it became the game of success as opposed to the game of fun, play, joy, everything else.

Dean Pohlman: And who do you think you were trying to please with with that?

Brian Dubow: I mean, it’s got to be my parents. You know, I think, I’ve learned that 95% of high performers and I’ll put myself in that pocket struggle from a feeling of I am not enough. And and so for me, and I still feel this way, unfortunately, I because I already know logically and logically that I can.

Dean Pohlman: You can we just get the logical and the emotional parts of the of the bodies are just like, hey, like, let me tell you what you should feel emotionally so you can just get on track and then we can move forward.

Brian Dubow: Yeah. Like if, if, if I knew if I were, if I emotionally truly knew that I was enough, I wouldn’t be taking actions out of fear. I’d be taking actions out of love. I wouldn’t feel the need to do shoulds. I would do the once. But there is a piece of me, a little child inside of me, a five year old that is still trying to prove for some reason or maybe a 12 year old, that he is enough to his parents and society.

Brian Dubow: And because of that, I sometimes get triggered and I sometimes take actions that are proving to the world that I am worthy of a place here. The reality is for everyone listening. You are all perfect, energetic, eternal beings. You are all enough just for being here. But you’re going back to what you were saying earlier, Dean. We all, unfortunately not all, have some type of programing that drives us to take actions in a certain way because we have something to prove.

Brian Dubow: And I’m not going to say it hasn’t served me. My desire to prove that I’m enough allowed me to push through 17 eight hour workweeks, allowed me to, you know, train harder than anyone else when I was doing an Ironman. It’s it’s a force that motivates me. But now it’s a force that makes it hard for me to slow down, hard for me to accept myself.

Brian Dubow: I love to hear it. I mean, I’d like to think you’re a high performer as well. How this has impacted you, Dean.

Dean Pohlman: I mean, yeah, I’ve. I’ve been on this journey, for a while. You know, I, I, like you were saying all these things, and I’m just not in my head, like, I know, but, like, Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so definitely, like, you know, it it tends to, it tends to come in and out. Like, there are times where I’m very in touch with this idea that I am doing a lot of what I’m doing because I don’t feel like I’m enough.

Dean Pohlman: And then, you know, I’m in I’ve been in therapy for almost ten years now, and a very common theme that I come back to is, you know, let’s let’s get in touch with this little five year old version of Dean who doesn’t feel like he’s good enough. And how’s that showing up? And then, you know, going into some of these exercises where I try to have conversations with this little Dean and say like, hey, dude, we have this.

Dean Pohlman: Like, we built this amazing business. And like you have you have over 500,000 subscribers on YouTube, and you have thousands of people who, you know, are part of your website. You and you sold hundreds of thousands of books and DVDs and like Little me is like, no way, no way. Are you serious? He’s like, yeah. I’m like, yeah, dude, we have this.

Dean Pohlman: We have this beautiful house, you have an amazing wife, you have two kids, and I’m like, oh my God, I do. I did it.

Brian Dubow: Yeah. Wow.

Dean Pohlman: And it’s, you know, it’s it’s really, it’s really I mean, it’s yeah, I mean, but no, I, I go through, I go through all of that and, you know, it’s, it’s kind of, this and then, but like, what I wanted to say about that is kind of like you were saying, you can’t just discount that those behaviors that and that lifestyle and that lifestyle is not the right word.

Dean Pohlman: You can’t just discount the behaviors and those protective mechanisms that you created for your social behavioral patterns that you created for yourself. Because they did they worked for you, right? They got you to where you are now. And I think a common trend that I, that I’ve seen and heard is like, it’s a lot of people who are similar to us, you know, maybe they’re in their, you know, 30s, maybe early 40s.

Dean Pohlman: And the, the way that they live their life have gotten them to this point where they are now and now, you know. Okay, cool. That got us from level one to level two. But in order to go from level two to level three, we need to be able to gently say to these behaviors, to these protective behaviors or mechanisms or, you know, coping behaviors that we’ve developed, say, like, hey, you know, I don’t this is this was helpful, and you helped me so much and you helped get me through a really hard time, but I don’t actually need this anymore.

Dean Pohlman: And so that’s kind of where I mean, that’s where I see a lot of self-development, you know, occurring, with men in particular. I think there’s also this trend. I think there’s a lot of men who don’t actually grow out of that level, like they’re just kind of like charging ahead forward, and they’re still like holding on to this wounded child, version of themself and trying to, like, go to the next level just by, like, grinding harder and harder.

Dean Pohlman: And so, you know, just like, never give up. And I’m like, I mean, you don’t have to, but, like, it’d be a lot easier if you just changed up your approach. So.

Brian Dubow: Yes, but that’s hard for people if they’ve been if they’ve been, you know, workaholics for 20 years straight, it’s more comfortable to be a burned out workaholic than it is to do nothing like so like one of my, one of my unlocks when I was in the grind was I did a ten day silent meditation retreat that, to me was way harder than an Ironman, than a marathon, than anything that forces me to push myself.

Brian Dubow: But yeah, the act of doing nothing, you know?

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, no. Like doing difficult, doing difficult work that actually forces you to deal with situations where you want to cry is way harder than working a ten hour day for an hour, 12 or 14 hour day, or like a whatever, whatever you want to call it. That’s usually a lot more challenging. And then, you know, things that people are used to.

Dean Pohlman: So and then there’s also the challenge of, you know, looking at it from the instead of looking at it from the extrinsic benefit of, we can reach the next level if we change, if we go back and change our behaviors, it has to be looked at for the intrinsic, you know, the benefit of just changing the behavior itself.

Dean Pohlman: And then cool. If as a result of that you also reach the next level, great. But you can’t like go into, you know, the work saying, oh, I’m going to do this because then I can stead of having like, you know, $1 million business, I can have a $10 million business. Totally. It’s it’s got to be the other way around.

Dean Pohlman: But, but yeah, I, I want to go back to like you. You’re asking yourself one of my pretending not to know. And do you remember, like, was it was it just for you? Was it just like, was it just like a flashing alarm that said, I’m not happy? Did it take you that much time to realize it?

Dean Pohlman: Or was there like, did you feel something in your body that was trying to make itself known, or was it just like, super automatic for you?

Brian Dubow: You know, I think it was slowly watching my light get dimmer. I think I am a very light person. And you know, I bring a lot of energy into a room and watching myself become the. When I first moved to New York, the most unusual person to the to become that person who, like, just wanted to stay in and chill.

Brian Dubow: Which there’s nothing wrong with that. But I was just like, that’s not me. I’m, you know, I’m I’m this extroverted guy who lights up a room. And I remember having dinner with my parents. One time, I guess I was home, in Miami for some reason. And they asked me, like, how’s it go? And I was working there, and I was like, I just don’t care.

Brian Dubow: I just don’t care. And I felt like I was having an out-of-body experience where I was watching myself saying, I just don’t care. And I had a moment where I was able to be like, I only have one life on earth. Like life is not a test run, not addresses. All this is that. And here I am. And what is the prime of my life?

Brian Dubow: The 20s. Saying that I don’t care about how I spend the majority of my waking hours in my life? What kind of life is that? So I think, I guess that’s a it seems like a small moment, but it was a big moment for me because because I was able to, look at it from a bird’s eye view and say, like, this can’t keep going like this.

Brian Dubow: But getting there was this gradual decline of not like a breaking point, but more of achieving a place of comfortably Numb as opposed to alive.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. I mean that’s a significant. Yeah. I since a significant time I remember I had a very I read about this in a Christmas email a few years ago. But I remember I guess I had a similar experience to you where I was like I was, but I wasn’t. I didn’t have a successful career. I had a really crappy career before this, where I was a I worked for a third party logistics company, and, I had had a really successful college and career.

Dean Pohlman: You know, I graduated with honors. I had three majors. I had a bunch of like, you know, really cool internships. I had a great resume, and I just didn’t ended up there just weren’t jobs for what I was interested in coming out of college or I just didn’t get them. And so I took a sales job totally unrelated to what I did.

Dean Pohlman: And I remember, you know, it’s a totally soul sucking job. Didn’t really rely on any of my strengths. I didn’t feel like I had, you know, just wasn’t motivated at all. And I remember being at a bar one night and I just said, like this more, right? I just ordered, like, ordered a drink, chugged it, ordered another drink, chug it, and then, you know, the bartender at that point was kind enough.

Dean Pohlman: He was like, you’re done. Like, all right, that’s fair. I was just like, but that was probably one of the few times of my life where I was like, I really just don’t like who I am right now, like, this is. And I’ve never. And, and that was, that was, that was does does tough. But I think shortly after that I did, you know, quit the job and started to see like, well, I got this YouTube channel, maybe I can do something with that.

Dean Pohlman: But yeah.

Brian Dubow: I think it’s brave in both of our situations to make a change without hitting rock bottom. Like, we we didn’t get to the point where we ran out of money or we’re raging alcoholics. We got to the point where we were finding mild ways to escape our lives here and there.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. I mean, I think you and I are also really lucky because we got that to like that got to occur for us when we were relatively young. You know, I think if that happens to you when you’re older, it’s so much harder. Like, I look at some people in my life who are, you know, 30 years older than me.

Dean Pohlman: And I’m like, wow, I can I can just like just going through my own experiences. I can look at your life and I can just, like, see for myself where you are not being honest with yourself or just like, you know, the coping mechanisms that you’re using or like the child with whom the child child would hoon’s childhood wounds that you’re choosing not to be responsible for.

Dean Pohlman: And you can just kind of see it, but like, for those, for those people, you know, they say like, I don’t know, it’s it might be too late. And I, I don’t, you know, in some ways I really sympathize with them and say, like, you know what it might be just because not because I don’t believe that they could if they really wanted to, but because, you know, not everybody has the same.

Dean Pohlman: Not everyone is exposed to the same ideas. Not everyone is in the same community. I think ultimately genetics are also like part of this, you know, like you look at people and I think about this a lot, but I, you know, the people who are more likely to change, they probably are, you know, they’re probably genetically more likely to change than people who are kind of more stuck in their ways.

Dean Pohlman: Like, doesn’t mean that it’s impossible, but it is harder. So, you know, I look at a lot of people who are in their 50s, 60s and 70s and who are thinking, well, I don’t know how to change now, and I think it’d be too hard. And I’m like, you know what? Like looking at how all the odds are maybe stacked in your stacked against you, like, yeah, I like I sympathize.

Dean Pohlman: I still think there’s like I still think it’s possible, but I also sympathize with you and your situation.

Brian Dubow: Yeah. I mean, I think about that as like, we’re living in the matrix. You want to take the red pill or the blue pill. And some people I’m forgetting which one is like the actually wake up or is is the other one is like, forget that. You know that you’re living in the matrix. But for some people, ignorance is bliss.

Brian Dubow: It’s way easier to just keep on thinking that, you know, a cup of Coca-Cola is happiness as opposed to something that fills your body with sugary sugar and clogs your arteries. It’s so much easier to just trust the marketing around us than to really get super intentional with our lives and get super intentional with our paths, and ask ourselves the hard questions that are going to trigger us.

Brian Dubow: Because, as you probably learned about therapy, it gets harder before it gets easier.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. I mean, and there’s also, you know, just the way that, you know, we just the there’s so many things that are that can distract us. There’s so many things that we willingly engage with to distract us from, from these things that you can live a totally happy life, totally like you can live a totally happy life by just going through life, going through your work, coming home, putting on the TV, scrolling on TikTok for four hours because you’re I mean, it’s it’s working, right?

Dean Pohlman: I mean, you know, can you imagine what would happen to society if, like, we lost, like, all of these different like, let’s say like alcohol and let’s say there’s no alcohol, there’s no TV shows, no streaming services. You just had to go home and like, talk with people and like, just be with your thoughts. Society would collapse in three days, collapse.

Brian Dubow: Absolutely. Collapse.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, I’m sure it would. Just people people would lose their minds. And you know, that’s it’s also something else I’ve thought a lot about as I like, you know, had my own mental health, struggles over the years is mental health. And like, all this stuff, this is a this is a fucking privilege. Not everybody gets the chance to be able to come home from work.

Dean Pohlman: Say, you know what? I don’t really think I want to be doing this anymore and then be able to change things up. They’ve got maybe they’ve got kids, maybe they’re maybe they’re barely making it, you know. So like this is something that also is it’s a privilege to be able to work on your mental health like it’s it’s a privilege to be able to live a live a life where you are your actions and your, you know, your day to day.

Dean Pohlman: Your day to day job is aligned with your values. Like this is not something that everybody gets the opportunity to do. So I think that’s also important.

Brian Dubow: I, I want to double down on that. These are high class problems. When I think about like the, the journey that humans are on and kind of my coaching arc, there’s a phase one is stuck that’s like, you know, you’re not happy, but you’re not really doing anything about it. You’ve just accepted this life is what it is.

Brian Dubow: That’s a large majority of people. Phase two is survival mode. That’s knowing that there’s a better life, but you’re just stretched too thin for some reason. You know, whether your your work is crazy or you’re juggling too many priorities and kids or you’re financially strapped, you’re just barely keeping your head above water. You know, that’s where the other major, the other large piece of people are just surviving through life as opposed to thriving.

Brian Dubow: To me, happiness gets you from surviving to thriving. Not because then you’re done with life, but because then you can go on your self-actualization journey. Then, when you are clear headed and not just figuring out how to make it to tomorrow, you can ask yourself, well, what is important to me? You know, that’s kind of what I call this self-awareness journey.

Brian Dubow: Who am I? What’s important to me? How do I want to make this life count? And this self-actualization journey of like turning a vision into reality. And as most of you and I know, like this, life is for creating. We can build whatever we want. You want to build a 500,000 500,000 person subscriber YouTube page you can like you want to do, you want to build, yoga studio that has locations all over America?

Brian Dubow: You can, if that’s what you want to do. That’s a self-actualization journey of creating whatever crazy dream pops into your imagination and bringing it to life, but without taking care of your mental health and without doing the things that get us from surviving and thriving. And that’s little things like exercise, meditation, journaling, like getting intentional with our finances, like connecting with people in a meaningful way, like practicing gratitude without getting from surviving to thriving and getting a baseline level of happiness.

Brian Dubow: It’s really hard to be, self-actualized and manifester that we all have within us.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. You know, I think there’s also a middle ground, right? Like, you know, you might be able to maybe you are in the position where you can really change your, you know, your external, you know, the external situation. But like you mentioned before, and I really like this quote, and I don’t know if you invented it, but it’s a really great quote.

Dean Pohlman: Happiness is an inside job. Did you invent that right away?

Brian Dubow: That’s one of the things I say in all my keynotes. So.

Dean Pohlman: Awesome. Okay, cool. So, you know, and, and this comes up, this is, I don’t know if this is a central tenet in Buddhism. I was reading a book on Buddhism recently. I don’t know if it’s built in probably as part of Buddhism to some, some extent. But there’s, you know, the idea that you can well, you can choose, you can change or you can change the external or you can change how the external affects you.

Dean Pohlman: You can change your reaction to it. Right. And this is, you know, I think a good book that does this is look at, Viktor Frankl, Man’s search for meaning, such a good book. Yeah. And yeah, it’s the one of the one of the, one of the essentials. But you know, the idea that, well, okay, this is what this is what is happening, and I can’t change it, but can I change the way that I think about it?

Dean Pohlman: And if you are not in a position where you are able to change the external situation, then you know you can start thinking about things differently. You can start thinking, well, what do I like about my job that brings meaning and fulfillment to that to me? Or you know what? What do I you know, this is a really being with my kids is really stressful.

Dean Pohlman: But how can I look at this in a way where, you know, it brings me fulfillment or joy? So I really like that you brought up that, you know, happiness is an inside job. And and recognizing that I think that’s yes, you can change the external. But if you can’t change, if you don’t learn how to change how you respond to things internally, then I mean, that’s, that’s, that’s that’s got to be the main thing.

Brian Dubow: I mean, I’m a believer that our external reality is just a reflection of our internal reality. So if our internal state is anxiety and chaos, our life is going to look like, uncertainty and very chaotic versus if we do the things we need to do, do the self maintenance to get to a place where we have total peace inside the external world will be a peaceful place to live.

Brian Dubow:

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. Well I don’t want to do another interview with you. And I want to get more into some of the work that you do with, with your clients. But I also have a part of the podcast where I like doing these rapid fire questions. And and that’s what I’m going to subjected to.

Brian Dubow: Now hit me.

Dean Pohlman: So all right, first question is what is one had a belief or mindset that’s helped you the most with your overall health and wellness?

Brian Dubow: I believe in the end of the story, no matter where I am in this story and ever any journey, I know that the end is me at the top of the rocky stairs with my hands up. So all of that, tough mental health battle. I’m having a month where I’m feeling really down. Although that’s my business.

Brian Dubow: Well, that’s, you know, my physical health and, you know, trying to get back into shape. I always believe in the end of the story, and I hold the picture of what it looks like at the end. And I believe that’s been huge in getting me to, bring those realities to life.

Dean Pohlman: Okay.

Brian Dubow: What’s yours, if you don’t mind me asking?

Dean Pohlman: Oh, shit, I don’t know. No one ever asked me these questions.

Brian Dubow: Yeah.

Dean Pohlman:

Dean Pohlman: I think I’d have to say that. Things I don’t know, there’s so many things. I think the one that’s coming at me right now is is trusting that, trusting that the universe that God has my back and that things happen for me, not to me. Like, I have to believe that. Yeah. Like, I have to believe that there is some sort of higher force that is that wants the best for me.

Brian Dubow: That’s beautiful.

Dean Pohlman: That’s beautiful. So thank you. What’s one thing that you do for your health that is often overlooked or undervalued by others.

Brian Dubow: It’s got to be my morning journaling practice. I do the morning pages every day, three pages of journaling first thing in the morning before I check my phone. I sleep with my song.

Dean Pohlman: Printed as there’s just free.

Brian Dubow: Form. A free form. Free form. It’s part of, something called the Artist’s Way. Three pages. Stream of consciousness, usually after a page and a half. You know, I’ll be like, I have nothing else to write about, but by having that for three page amount, I break through a wall. And that’s where the good things come through.

Brian Dubow: So I do recommend journaling, where you have a forced amount of space as opposed to a forced. This like I’ll journal every day until I run out of things to write. It’s on the other things of writing running out that you really tap into your intuition that you.

Dean Pohlman: That handwriting is terrible. Awful. I could just imagine.

Brian Dubow: Absolutely awful. I just, I honestly have this is my journal. I have probably 10 or 12 of these filled up in my closet.

Dean Pohlman: Okay. Yeah. And believe it, I’ve got a whole journal. I got a whole drawer full of journals. What’s yours?

Brian Dubow: What’s the habit?

Dean Pohlman: It’s a mindfulness practice of some sort. It could be anything. I mean, whatever mindfulness is to you, I think for me, doing, like, a good, you know, doing like a an immersive 30 minute, yoga session where I’m focused on body awareness and breath. It just it does incredible things. Just does incredible things for me.

Dean Pohlman: So,

Brian Dubow: I think I. Yeah, I gotta get you on a vision quest. Dena, have you ever done a vision quest?

Dean Pohlman: Oh, God. Community. Yeah. Break. Just, I’ll. I’ll be ready for it sometime.

Brian Dubow: Again?

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, I, there’s there’s those are things on my list. Yeah. When I, when I, when I’m ready. Yeah. Yeah. What’s the most stressful part of your day to day life?

Dean Pohlman: That’s a.

Brian Dubow: Good question. The most stressful part of my day to day life.

Brian Dubow: Is battling my own tendency for workaholism. It’s the fact that I’m no longer in this place where I need to fill every hour of every day with business opportunities and with, you know, productivity. But my natural inclination is to fill every gap in my day. And so as much as I’ve worked on telling myself that I’m enough, it’s battling that little guy and, convincing myself it’s okay to, as you said earlier, like, cut the day off at two and go read a book in a coffee shop from 3 to 6 p.m. or two, or go for, you know, a three hour walk.

Brian Dubow: It’s fighting the urge for everything to be productive.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, I hear that.

Dean Pohlman: What’s right? Oh, no, I can’t, now I’m now I’m thinking about it as you’re talking. No one’s ever done this to me before. Most stressful part of my day to day life. The thing that’s sitting with me right now is the desire to create, the compulsion to create certainty, or the compulsion to the compulsion to control things, to control the outcome.

Dean Pohlman: So not being able to, you know, fighting the desire to close the loop on things to, you know, put a bow on it to be able to mark it off the To-Do list, to be able to resolve things and just be okay with the way that it is. That’s probably that’s probably the hardest part of my my day to day life.

Brian Dubow: Have you read the Surrender Experiment?

Dean Pohlman: Nope. Not yet.

Brian Dubow: It’s one of those books where I think, to me, the overarching lesson is like, life is trying to give us all the love, abundance, adventure, and everything else you could ever want. But instead we get in the way and try to inspire control and try to assert, well, as opposed to just letting the flow of the river guide us where we’re meant to be.

Brian Dubow: Yeah. I don’t want to tell you more because I think it’s a worthy read, but, it’s, relevant to what you’re saying.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. Okay. Sounds like it sounds like a good book. It’ll probably end up in. It’ll probably end up on my porch two days from now.

Brian Dubow: I actually will probably sign it till we all send me your address. Oh. Merry Christmas.

Dean Pohlman: Thank you, thank you. Yeah, I’ve got a great bookshelf for it. All right, last question. What’s your best piece of advice for men who want to be healthier?

Brian Dubow: This is probably what the thing that got me the belief that got me to where I am today. And maybe you’ve heard this, but mood follows action. Mood follows action. What I mean by that is that most people wait until they’re certain, in a certain mood, to take an action. They wait until they’re energized to exercise.

Brian Dubow: They wait until they’re calm to meditate. They wait until they’re feeling social to go to the party or the gathering or wherever. Go to the park, when in reality, the mood follows the action. By exercising, you feel energized. By meditating, you feel calm. By being on this podcast with you and feeling so connected. I’m ready to go connect with other people, so we have to short circuit our brains to take action regardless of how we feel, and now will get us unstuck and to the happier, happier life.

Brian Dubow: And if you can’t do it on your own, find an accountability buddy and agree. And they’re like, hey, we’re going to meet at the gym. We’re going to, you know, text each other when we meditate, the journal or whatever it all is like. It’s not that you don’t know what will make you happy, it’s that you don’t feel like doing the thing that will make you happy.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, yeah. That reminds me of the, that was one of the first books I read in the South, and space was the Mark Manson book. On, it’s called The Subtle Love, not the subtle art of not giving a fuck. Yeah. And, one of the concepts that I found that book and that I try to tell everyone else is just like you said, instead of thinking that motivation leads to action, does that action leads to motivation.

Dean Pohlman: And it’s the other way around is by taking action that you feel motivated not by, you know. Yeah, not my motivation.

Brian Dubow: That applies to feeling doing, feeling good. And also I like to say as you walk the path, the path unfolds. So for anyone who like needs control or doesn’t want to take action until they can see the whole picture, the path unfolds. Once you start taking action towards the whatever goal is to start today, you know? Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: All right. Cool. Well, Brian gives some, where can people find you?

Brian Dubow: Yeah, I, I have a podcast, The Hit of Happiness podcast, a blog on the hit of happiness. Com I’m on Instagram at Head of Happiness. And also, you know, feel free to reach out. You know, if you are struggling with happiness or struggling with, you know, I’m about making life count. If you’re feeling stuck, if you feel like you, if you resonate with what I said earlier, I’m on a journey to help people feel alive.

Brian Dubow: So don’t hesitate to reach out to me. Whatever.

Dean Pohlman: Cool. All right, guys, six shows for that. All right, man. Well, Brian, thanks for coming on. We’ll do another follow up episode shortly here. And guys, I hope you enjoyed this episode. I hope it inspires you to be a better man.

Brian Dubow: Dean. Thank you. Thanks for having me. It was awesome.

Dean Pohlman: Thank you. Brian. Hey guys. Hope you enjoyed that episode. Check the links for anything that we mentioned here. You can check out Brian Dubbo and Head of Happiness on all of his links and socials. He also does one on one coaching if you want to reach out directly to him. If you’re liking this podcast, please leave a review.

Dean Pohlman: You can do that wherever you’re listening on Apple, on Spotify, or whatever other platform you’re on. If you want to learn more about the man, follow yoga community and join this community where we work on our wellness as men, where we work on all the things that we talk about here in the Better Man podcast, you can learn more and do a free seven day trial at man for yoga.com/join that will get you access to our community, both in our private Facebook group as well as in the members area and app.

Dean Pohlman: And of course, if you’re not quite ready for that, we do have a free seven day challenge, which is a great way for you to see how yoga can help you in your everyday life. Not with just your fitness, but also with your overall mindfulness and your mental wellness. You can sign up for that for free with no credit card at Mandalay yoga.com/7 DC.

Dean Pohlman: Thanks guys for watching. Hope this episode inspires you. I hope it inspires you to be a better man and I’ll see you on the next episode. Stick around, because we’re going to be doing another follow up interview with Brian.

[END]