How Men Can Improve Their Relationships With Their Partners | Emilio Palafox | Better Man Podcast Ep. 054

Dean Pohlman: Hey, guys, it’s Dean. Welcome to the Better Man podcast. Today I am joined by Emilio Palafox, who is redefining what it means to be a man, and he is the co-founder of Relationship Renegade. So we’re going to talk about relationships in this episode. Amelia, thanks for joining me.

Emilio Palafox: Thank you so much for having me.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. So I’m really excited about this for a lot of reasons because I’m a big proponent of working on your relationships, not just having them stagnant. I also recognize that the relationship ups are so automatic, you know, like you establish these patterns with your partner in the early you know, in the early days of the relationship. And those things that you do, whether you did them consciously or not, they form the foundation of your relationship and they persist, you know, through the years and years of your relationship.

Dean Pohlman: It’s kind of like how, you know, we have these extremely formative experiences as kids and then like we spend our twenties and thirties and forties, like trying to understand, Oh, that’s what messed me up. Cool. Let’s go back to this thing and let’s dig into this through like ten years of therapy and like, we had to figure out like this.

Dean Pohlman: So yeah, Anyways, and I’m also really interested in going into this because I’ve only recently understood this, but relationships are actually more important to your overall health than genetics, than your workouts, than your nutrition. This is like the number one determinant when it comes to your overall health and happiness. So I think we should start off there. Let’s let’s talk about why relationships are so more important than we think.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, you said some great things that will provide a lot of great legs to this conversation because especially when you think about, like you said, the foundation and how you enter and what that does down the line from the relationship, I think I would maybe even start there to answer your questions and more for what you said is, you know, with our company relationship renegades, one of the things that we always talk about with like the fundamentals or the foundation for like Great soil is if both parties are committed to growth.

Emilio Palafox: Right? Because we believe, like I’m looking outside right now, I can see trees and everything and flowers. If a flower is not growing, it’s dying. You know, if a tree is not growing, it’s dying. And so I think the same is with us and so if both parties are committed to growth, that’s great. Step number one. Number two is if both parties understand that triggers are gifts just wrapped in really ugly wrapping paper, then.

Emilio Palafox: And that’s a whole conversation as to why it’s a gift and how you can unwrap that and kind of like what you said, all of a sudden you’re like, Oh wow, I was getting triggered. And there was this reaction, this resonance, and there’s a reason why there’s a resonance there. And of course, that’s what you were talking about.

Emilio Palafox: Like you go back to like, Oh, wow, this is what messed me up back then. And you better, you know, the process. Is that becoming a better It is becoming a better man, but like to kind of it’s almost like unbecoming to find that better men.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, it’s like finding an area of opportunity. It’s like, Oh, this is a big weakness. Like, this is something I’m like, thinking about it in terms of a workout, but like, Oh, wow, I just realized my hip flexors are really weak. So if I work on this, yes, I can. I can really improve things.

Emilio Palafox: I love that. Yeah, absolutely. And then the third to kind of maybe just to write the three main things in terms like fertile soil and the skills fundamentals to us, at least the third one would be, okay, you got triggered. I got triggered if I get triggered. Rachel knows my wife that I need to look the man in the mirror.

Emilio Palafox: If she gets triggered, she knows that she looks to look the woman in the mirror. And what we do for each other in those situations is that we’ll just create a safe space where we both feel safe, seen, heard and loved. And with that underlying theme, we’re able to remove that resonance within us so that when that happens again, there is no trigger.

Emilio Palafox: Because I’ve removed what was within. I had find out like all was weak and we can we can address that together. And so that question that you provided really I guess I wanted to start there because that’s the foundation for us. Hmm. Okay.

Dean Pohlman: I want to I want to dig into this a little bit more, you know, because some of these things, like both parties committed to growth. Mike, do you ever need to have that conversation? But, you know, with all things, creating clarity is is much more effective when you get incredibly clear on things, not just like assuming things So so I want to get I want to get into that a little bit more, but I kind of want to I kind of want to have like a more general converse session to to get into this.

Dean Pohlman: And, you know, I’m just thinking, what are what are some of the biggest mistakes that people make in relationships? And I’m not talking about like going out with the Bro’s and, you know, hiring a prostitute, but maybe, maybe like, you know, in our day to day interactions and how we treat each other, what are some good intention things that we do that are actually harmful?

Emilio Palafox: That’s a great question. You know, the first one comes to my mind and it’s it’s an oldie but goodie. I’m not sure if you’ve heard of it. It’s kind of it went viral a long time ago. It’s a whole it’s not about the mail. Have you seen that video now?

Dean Pohlman: Now? Oh, yeah. Yeah. She has a nail in her head and he’s like, she’s like, this really hurts. And he’s looking at her like, you just. Just pull the nail out and you just get.

Emilio Palafox: Just nail you. She’s like, Yeah. She’s like, I just. Yeah, yeah. She’s like, I have a headache right now and all this kind of stuff. And it’s like, it’s probably cause she’s like, Yeah, my sweaters are getting torn. I don’t know why. And it’s like, you know, so. And, you know, he’s like, Yeah, pretty surgeon. Get that nail.

Emilio Palafox: I can get that nail out for you. Let me do that. Right. So, you know, basically what I’m saying here, the first way to talk about is how men want to fix things. And when a lot of this can just be partners. We both have whoever your partner is, I think we both have different masculine and feminine energies within us.

Emilio Palafox: And just like a battery has a positive a negative, right? We have both of those things within us. And on the feminine energy side of things, just the energy piece. Just want to feel safe seeing heard love. Let me just share. Let me just spent I just want you to like just acknowledge what I’m going through. And I think the masculine energy in whichever partner has a tendency to just like I can help you, I can fix you.

Emilio Palafox: I know what’s going on. And I think that’s just a very important thing, and I don’t think that’ll ever that’s something that has been talked about a lot, but I don’t think can be talked about enough because, you know, in our relationship it’s a good intention. But as much as I feel like I know I can help or fix things, if I just shut up and I’m just being there and breathing through what she’s going through, um, she loves me.

Emilio Palafox: So much more and we’re so connected and she feels so much better. So I think that’s one thing in terms of other intentions that we may have, but that can be a mistake. When you pause for a moment.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, I can just touch on that. I mean, that’s something that I realized. I grew up kind of in this in a in a family where it wasn’t about validation. It was about, hey, but like, let’s look on the bright side of things. And it wasn’t out of like, some sort of, you know, and I’ve talked about this with my wife, but that that wasn’t out of some ill will.

Dean Pohlman: It wasn’t because we were like, oh, like, you know, that sucks. And you just shouldn’t think that way. You should look at this instead and you shouldn’t be feeling that way. It’s more like, Well, I want to make you feel better, so I want you to look on the bright side. So I’m going to remind you of things on the bright side.

Dean Pohlman: And I’ve really made an effort over the past. Past couple of years. Yeah, really. I think within the last year to instead of like, try to get people to look on the bright side and get my wife, my partner, look on the bright side, I instead like, no, that sucks. Like, you lost something here. Like this is not the way you wanted to go.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: And I think focusing on that instead of like trying to make them feel better. Yeah. Because they’ll make themselves feel better, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Emilio Palafox: And I think you know what you’re just saying? What you’re just seeing right now is reminding me of something else. It’s like it comes with this phrase that you often hear in society of you complete me, you know, like. Like I was half and you were half and like, I’m going to do my best to fill your cup and I’m going to do my best to make you happy.

Emilio Palafox: And that’s all good intentions, But we feel that that’s the wrong approach, that that’s that to us, as in this conversation, the quote unquote mistake. I don’t like to think about things as mistakes. Thinking makes it so it’s more of we believe that, like it’s my job to make myself happy and it’s Rachel’s job to make herself happy.

Emilio Palafox: Everything else is just a bonus. But we come into the relationship and continue to come into the relationship. Here’s a glass right now, right? I do my best to fill my cup up towards full and overflowing, and she does the same. So we’re two cups coming in with full glass is overflowing. And if ever if it ever gets depleted, meaning a life event happen, some kind of loss happened.

Emilio Palafox: I got triggered at work and I I’m emotionally just suffering here, what have you. Then then can I? Of course, you know, be there and create a safe space where where my partner feels safe. Seen her in love and see, like, does she need me? Does she want me to put my my help? Her hat on or does she want me to just listen?

Emilio Palafox: Right. Or whatever it may be. But I think it’s important to know that I think people because this just goes about like not just the relationship we have with our partner, but the relationship we have with ourselves, the world around us, to friends, all interactions. But the relationship to self is most important. I think if people have that switch of like, okay, I know what I need to feel peaceful, joyful and abundant, and when I fall off that I’m aware that I need to do A, B, and C, I need to go be silent.

Emilio Palafox: I need to have my time with God. I need to have my time with friends or so. And I need to communicate that with love And consciously. And I think when both parties know what they can do to get back in balance, in alignment, in connection, fill up the cup, if you will, then I think that’s a great different mindset to have.

Emilio Palafox: Then like let me make you be happy, because then there’s the codependency. They’re like, I need someone else. And we want people to know that like you have everything within you and everything else is just a bonus. And like I get to have, I choose to have this partner. It’s not coming from a need. I need it because I’m not whole.

Emilio Palafox: It’s like, No, I am whole. Everyone here that’s listening is whole and beautifully whole. And we want people to have that realization because from that mindset there’s exponential growth in a relationship. So in summary, we believe that if you know how to take care of yourself, if you know how to fill up that cup and really love yourself enough because everyone listening here is whole, beautifully whole and we want people to know that and to embody that and to experience that because you are And if you don’t feel that you are, then that’s where the work comes in, right?

Emilio Palafox: Like, how can I make myself realize that I am whole? Because when both people come into a relationship or maybe already into a relationship and realize that then that relationship can be exponential. Mm hmm.

Dean Pohlman: So it’s not just about you making the other person happy. You have to have a solid foundation of yourself, and you also have to you know, you and I talked about this before we started the call, but it’s more than just just getting together and having couples counseling sessions all the time. There has to be solo work that you do in order to make sure that you are in a place where you’re coming into the relationship, where you’re I mean, you know, this is kind of a cliche, but you’re coming to a relationship to contribute, right?

Dean Pohlman: You’re not coming to to take away. And I think a lot of us kind of you know, I think most of us understand that if we’ve heard, you know, some just some rudimentary, rudimentary information on how to have good relationships, I think implementing that into practice and being aware of some of the behaviors that are not reflective of that, I think that’s I think that’s a lot that’s more difficult.

Dean Pohlman: I think that’s what we’re I’d like to get into in this conversation is something else I wanted to bring up is kind of this idea of masculine versus feminine energy. And I’m wondering if, you know, maybe it’s just the way that it’s phrased like maybe, for example, if we thought of it in maybe if we said like yin and yang, then then men would be much more interested in have it in like having more of that, that yin energy, you know.

Dean Pohlman: But I think there’s like when we talk about feminine energy and like just for me, for like when I’m thinking about this, like, no, I want to be masculine. I don’t want to be feminine. So like, so like, yeah, we talk about these other aspects of who we are and I think we think of them as feminine. Then it’s like, I don’t that’s, that’s not part of me that I want to, like, come out.

Dean Pohlman: I want to be masculine, man. So like, yeah, I think it just made me think of, you know, maybe there’s a, you know, it’s I guess I guess it’s just me getting with the program and understanding like feminine energy doesn’t mean that I’m less of a man. It’s just a different type than masculine. You know?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah. In a different light or a different perspective. You know, right now I’m in Marina del Rey. You know, we’ve. We’re digital nomads. We’re traveling all over the world for, you know, month to month, Airbnbs and whatnot. Right now we’re in Marina del Rey and the oceans right next to us. And so a great perspective would be, you know, one is the ocean and the other is the ship.

Emilio Palafox: And the ship is there to it’s just stable in a mission to get to a destination. And the other one is just kind of like being and just kind of receiving all the elements. And it’s just now both are powerful. The ocean is can be soft, but just like Bruce Lee would say, like, be like water, it could also be very destructive.

Emilio Palafox: It’s very powerful right in nature. And the ship is there to kind of just be anchored in in mission and in purpose. And and the other one is just wild. The ocean is wild and very beautiful and very powerful. And and so I think those are maybe some other elements of the two sides of the yin and yang.

Emilio Palafox: And both are important and both need each other. But maybe that’s maybe shedding a different light as well.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. Like I’d much rather be the ocean in the ship than the masculine. The feminine, I guess.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: But yeah, I think that’s a great points. So I’ll move on to the next question that I, that I have kind of a talking point is what’s something that people can do so in in relationship renegades you kind of talk about how do we get to this higher love relationship which is basically getting above a an average good what I’ll call a functional relationship, right?

Dean Pohlman: Like, it’s not so bad that you’re going to leave, but it’s also not like, great, how do you get in? All of us want to have great relationships. I want to have an above average relationship. So what is the difference between, you know, a functional average relationship and a higher love or a great relationship?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, And I first want to start off by saying that, you know, we’re all different, right, based on our genes or epigenetics or upbringing and everything. And so I don’t feel like there is a cookie cutter way. I think there’s different routes up the mountain and I want to be able to respect and understand and talk about how people achieve their own higher love for us, the higher love and we call it a higher love simply because if we’re talking consciousness and I want to start off here to answer this question, there’s a collective consciousness of any topic, right?

Emilio Palafox: Like there was a four minute, you know, before the four minute mile. There was a collective consciousness that was that was impossible. It was like whatever it was before that, right? There was a collective consciousness. At one point there was like, You want to fly in the sky, That’s impossible, right? There was a collective consciousness at some point where it’s like these phones that we have, oh, we’re going to able to interact business all over the world and it’s going to fit in your pocket.

Emilio Palafox: What are you talking about? That’s impossible until it’s possible. And so there’s a certain collective consciousness in society where all of us are thinking of like what marriage looks like, what would children look like, what a partnership looks like, of what relationships are. It’s like, Oh, yeah, like we’re digital nomads. We’re like, Oh, you better do that because you’re not going to be able to when you have kids.

Emilio Palafox: And I’m like, Wow, that’s a sort of story. But when we do it, when we’re traveling, we see families, five kids, one kid newborn that are doing the exact same thing that we’re doing. They’re doing world schooling and they’re peaceful, joyful and abundant. And it’s incredible. And it’s just such a if you believe you can, you can. And if you believe you can’t, you can’t.

Emilio Palafox: And so I wanted to start off there. Like the belief is super important. That sense. And then to answer more deeply with this question, I think we started to hit it right in the beginning of this conversation. You know, with anything else you need the fundamentals, the foundation and those fundamentals is to us, the higher love is well read before we go into the three again, the reason we call it a higher love is because it’s a state of the collective consciousness, let’s say, is here in the middle.

Emilio Palafox: If people can see me, it only takes one person to think differently or to act differently or to be differently and to kind of rise above, if you will. And when one person does, when one person like says, you know what, now I am going to hit that for me and does it, and he’s the only person to do it now.

Emilio Palafox: The collective consciousness believes that it can happen and all of a sudden they rise up to then hitting for a minute miles until someone else passes that. So how can we think about what the collective consciousness now in relationships? Oh, this is what this is. This is how this is. Oh, you know what, though? Ball and chain, you’re going to fight in this in that.

Emilio Palafox: This is. Yeah, no worries. You know, relationships are hard, right? You hear that? Relationships are hard. All relationships like just think about what we think about relationships and what would be the impossible in relationships. How do we rise above and have a higher love? And so when we say higher love, that’s what I’m talking about. Oh, creating new standards, new standards, new baselines to what’s possible in life, love and relationships.

Emilio Palafox: How can we all together? Because we’re not just the relationship renegades. You all are. We all are. We need each other. And and if we understand the fundamentals of, okay, we’re all committed to growth. You’re right, Dean. You’re committed to growth. I’m committed to growth. Great. Because there’s a lot of people that don’t like self-development that think it’s just like, whatever, woo, woo.

Emilio Palafox: Like, I don’t want to get into that. I don’t need growth. What do you mean? I need to love myself like I’m fine, you know, whatever. If both people are like, You know what? I’m stepping into this. I know I need to work on myself. Great. Both parties agree on that. That’s a great first step. Again. Second, if both people realize that triggers are gifts and that’s a whole deep conversation, then there’s a lot of fruit that can be born from that.

Emilio Palafox: And then third, when they do get triggered, both parties, both partners, both friends, are finding ways to just create a container of safe space where they feel safe, seen, heard and loved. Now, that’s what we’ve been talking about. To kind of add some more legs to it. There’s this thing of here’s the thing. We the number one human impediment is that we live in our heads with this constant ego centered.

Emilio Palafox: I’m not good enough, I don’t have enough. Or maybe I’m better then mentality. So and people, especially nowadays in relationships, we’re in the past because our stories are running us and that’s depression. Or we’re in the future hoping, wishing, praying, or maybe even afraid of what may come next. And that’s anxiety. But as we all know, right, Like, how can we continue to practice being in the moment where there’s no stories in the head?

Emilio Palafox: Because what we do. Dean Right. Is we we create stories in relationships like this is what’s happening. Oh, I know what’s happening here. Oh, yeah, he did this, she did this or whatever it may be. We create a story in her head. We fuze to that story. Emotions arise from that story. And guess what? The next thing you know, we’ve created our own suffering.

Emilio Palafox: And so. Right so like, we’re constantly in our heads with this. But the reason I’m bringing this up is as humans we’re constantly judging and we may know it consciously for mindful it, or we may be subconscious or subconscious to it, but if we’re judging any person, place or thing, soon as we’re in judgments, people may be judging what I’m saying right now.

Emilio Palafox: Soon as you’re judging, you’re literally blind. You no longer can see the actuality that’s in front of you. All you’re seeing is your own reality and projecting that reality based on what you’ve gone through in life. But that is only your planet, your reality. You’re you’re not able to see the actuality of this person. Like you’re not even able to see the beauty, the soul, the spirit, the energy that the essence of this person.

Emilio Palafox: And I think the higher love, that’s the next leg to get into it is like, are we really seeing our partner for everything that they are? Are we constantly projecting this own reality that I have within me? And so I think that’s an important note to make.

Dean Pohlman: So yeah, I want to share kind of my own experience with this and this had to do with some of the early days of Marissa and I as a couple counseling. This is when we had Declan as a newborn and we were really struggling and we the kind of the root of the reason we were suffering was because we had these stories that we were telling ourselves about the other person that were causing suffering, like essentially exactly what you were saying.

Dean Pohlman: And specifically this was I thought that Marissa was constantly mad at me because I wasn’t doing enough to help with the baby or I wasn’t doing what she wanted me to. And so whenever I was at home, I was just like in this constant state of like, I hope she doesn’t yell at me. I’m hope I’m doing the right thing.

Dean Pohlman: I hope I look busy enough and hope I’m like, I hope she wants me to make dinner right now. I hope she wants me to hope she’s okay with me. Like helping out with the laundry instead of like, helping.

Emilio Palafox: Out with the.

Dean Pohlman: Baby. And and and she thought that she. She thought that I wasn’t getting things done because she was thinking about. She was thinking about a kind of a list of to do things, let’s say, on list a And then I was thinking of to do things on list B, all of which needed to happen in order to make our home like a, you know, a happy, clean home or like a Fed baby.

Dean Pohlman: But we just weren’t, you know, we we had stories in our head. And so that was something that I think that was a really good example of us, you know, telling stories to ourselves that ultimately and led to suffering.

Emilio Palafox: And, you know, I’m so glad that you brought that up, because one of the things that we tell our clients and have been very fruitful and beneficial for not only us, but, you know, the people that we that we coach and that we mentor, etc., is when we use that language like, you know, hey, like, you know, hey, partner, I have a story in my head that, you know, that this is happening right now or that you want this or that.

Emilio Palafox: This is what, you know, whatever. And and and we look to say like true self, false self and like true self being kind of like your higher self, whatever you want to call it. It’s all lingo and semantics, but in like ego, self false self kind of situation. Richard Rau does a really good job of describing those too.

Emilio Palafox: I love that language for me at least, and we feel like I can be like, Hey, hey babe, my ego self, my false self is like creating these stories and it’s almost like you get to like put it outside of you. Like it’s because it’s not you, but it’s like, you know, I’m just this like, spirit, having this, like, human experience.

Emilio Palafox: My meat suit is feeling all these, like, feelings and emotions right now because of this story. And I get to, like, put it outside of me and be like, Isn’t that interesting? She’s like, Oh, so glad that you brought that up. Like, I was. I mean, my story, she’s putting it outside of her, like my story and my like this body is experiencing X, Y, Z.

Emilio Palafox: Isn’t that interesting way to compare these? Like, Oh, wow, that is interesting. Is that crazy? And like, talk about it consciously because we’re like, we’re these two spirits having this human experience and the fact that we can talk about it and like laugh about it and be like, Wow, that’s crazy. What I think that is, and just be kids about it.

Emilio Palafox: Like, hey, we’re we’re all just like walking each other home here. We’re all just like, trying to do our best here. How could we take that outside of us and talk about these observations? And I think that really helps. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: So the next question that that I kind of have on here is if we talk to a lot about you talked about triggers as gifts, like those are the big areas of opportunity. And I can personally attest that like, I don’t know if it is triggers per se, but when, you know, when I found in my own relationship that when Marissa and I have the really tough conversations, like the things that are like, okay, this is like really painful to discuss, that’s when you know, that’s when I think we strengthen our relationship the most significantly is when we do have those difficult conversations.

Dean Pohlman: It’s one reason that I really value our relationship because we had to go through, I think, our first two years, we had to go through a lot compared to other relationships. And it’s one of the reasons I value our relationship, because we really had to go through some difficult things, like her mom, you know, we found out that her mom had stage four cancer when she was 20, forgot how old she was.

Dean Pohlman: But, you know, that happened. She died ten months later, got engaged the next month, got married. The year after that, she got pregnant and month after a couple months after that. So she we went through a lot of things. We really had to have difficult, difficult discussions. But those are really hard to do and you can’t do them all the time.

Dean Pohlman: So my question here is like, yeah, like triggers, like these are opportunities, but what are some more lighthearted interactions that can lead to growth? Because like if we spent every night talking about triggers, you would be just exhausted, you know? So like, like what are what are some like more what are some what are some easier things that people can do on a day to day basis to help strengthen their relationships?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, So some lighthearted things. Me and my partner often talk about love routines. So a lot of people, you know, have these morning routines at night routines and efficient and effective breaks for high performance and to do well in your job and all of your interactions. But, you know, a lot of times we can get and I’ll raise my hand on this one because we’re we’re entrepreneurs, we work together.

Emilio Palafox: And a lot of times we have to practice and are challenged, you know, to take those date nights, right. To be able to, like, spend time with ourselves, like out of the business and really just into ourselves. So what we really try to practice and it’s not always perfect, but is these love routines. And so some love routines for us and every loved routine is going to be different.

Emilio Palafox: We’re also in the TV and film because, you know, that’s been some of our gives talents and strengths as well, and we want to be able to utilize that at a greater platform to continue to provide conscious media for these types of conversations. Right. To help move humanity forward in a beautiful way. Now, I mention that simply because one of the love routines right off the bat is called Morning Shenanigans for us.

Emilio Palafox: So this is really light because morning shenanigans. We love comedy, we love comedy and we love improv. And so because when we wake up the morning pillow talk, if you when we wake up is we have this deadpan comedy where the game is, we’re both going to say the most ridiculous, outlandish stuff to each other while holding a straight face.

Emilio Palafox: So, you know, it’s like this kind of Will Ferrell like, just like I’m going to, you know, whatever. And I just say say it in real straight face and and basically the person who laughs loses, right? And so we’ll go back and forth, go back and stuff and just making each other laugh so hard. Of course, my wife was not good at this a very beginning.

Emilio Palafox: She always loves to talk about that and how she’s like extremely good and like it is completely switched. I used to win all the time at this is like day date. I can all this face now. She just crushes me. And then also throughout the day we like to do this normally in the morning, but sometimes it always doesn’t work out that way.

Emilio Palafox: But we’ll have times. We know that meditation is powerful. We know that when two or more are gathered, it’s even greater. And so we try our best to meditate together. And the point is just to do it at least 5 minutes. So it’s a five minute marker. If we go more than that, which we often do because we’re already in it, then fantastic.

Emilio Palafox: But because we want to get 1% better every single day and not have this rollercoaster, it’s like, how can we just get 1% better every single day? And it’s at five, it’s at 5 minutes, right? That we meditate together to visualize, to be to be in silence, because that does a lot for the mind body and spirit. Right.

Emilio Palafox: And then we also want to really connect. I think it’s important to really connect to ourselves and each other. And so we’re big fans of eye gazing and and I don’t know if you’ve done eye gazing before, it’s kind of kind of how.

Dean Pohlman: I’ve heard of it. I’ve heard of it, and I. And I’ve. I’ve heard of it. Yeah, I have not before. I did it to my wife on our wedding day and she was really mad because I was just staring at her because I hadn’t seen her a day. So I was like staring at her and she’s like, Stop staring at me.

Dean Pohlman: You’re supposed to look at other things. I’m like, I don’t think so. I’m just going to keep staring at you and see. I love it so informally, but yeah.

Emilio Palafox: Informal. Yeah. And it’s kind of like it’s very we do this at our events kind of group izing sessions that I lead, but it’s very specific. So it would be, you know, like a feet away from each other. So you’re really close. You could be sitting down or standing up. Normally we sit down in Indian style. My partner will have the legs over me and vice versa.

Emilio Palafox: We’ll get really close and we’ll have our hands connecting, palm facing my left hand is Palm facing up and my right hand is palm facing down. And then my partner will connect to that. And then we the key here is to look left eye to left eye. So my left eye is looking at her left eye. And same thing with her.

Emilio Palafox: That’s the most receiving eye. And there’s a whole longer conversation as to why that’s the case and complete silence when we start and we’ll put the timer to 5 minutes again. Sometimes we go long, but it’s always 5 minutes and we connect and provide. That sounds very simple, but it is profound what I gaze in, the scientist said with an eye gazing, like the testimonials of eye gazing.

Emilio Palafox: What’s actually happening? It is absolute profound, the connection that you have, because a lot of times in relationships we just want to be seen, whether it’s consciously or subconsciously. And sometimes the other partner doesn’t feel like that person really sees me for who I am. And a lot of times language is limited and when you can just be in silence and doing nothing and just being with that person, there’s something that is really special that comes from that and the energy that is shared there that really sinks in a really deep conversation for intimacy, for for business, for for your self-growth and the growth together.

Emilio Palafox: Hmm.

Dean Pohlman: Do you think so? Now I’m going to have to go ask my wife. Okay. You want to do some ideas? Here’s how we do it. Yeah, I think. I think. I think should do it for at least a couple of minutes until she says, okay, let’s go, let’s go. I know.

Emilio Palafox: She’s like, Oh, yeah.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, she knows I’m weird. She’s just like, she’s totally accepted my weirdness, so that’s good. I love it. So I’m curious why you’re doing this activity, you know, Is there I’m just curious about engaging itself. Like, is there do you think there’s like a transfer of emotions as you’re doing it? Is there like a transfer of of understanding as you’re doing it?

Dean Pohlman: Like just by looking at each other in the eyes? Like, do you like, oh, I know how you’re feeling now.

Emilio Palafox: This is a deep conversation. So I’ll start off here. I’ve been gazing for about eight years and you know, whether it’s me, myself and I in the mirror together in a relationship or group settings, when I’m doing some deep inner work and some kind of intense.

Dean Pohlman: You can do it to yourself.

Emilio Palafox: Yes. Very, very incredible. Powerful practice, very powerful practices. And I have a story about that, too, on how I finally saw who I was and how strong I was and how beautiful I was, because I never used to think those things. And it took a lot of shedding to finally see that in the mirror when I did Samir work.

Emilio Palafox: But to answer your question, so I’ve been doing it for about eight years, but six years ago I was at this mental health gala in Utah and we were raising money for mental health. And I had met this owner of a mental health clinic in Utah. And the person that clinic has like 100% success rate in what they do.

Emilio Palafox: And he was talking about why they do it and they spend like millions of dollars in their products, services and technologies to help move this forward depression, anxiety, PTSD, suicide, all this stuff. And he says, Oh yeah, we have biometrics, we have like the MRI scans. We have like all this stuff where we can track, measure all these things and this technology that helps with this and this technology helps that.

Emilio Palafox: But then at the very end of things, he’s like, you know what works the best though? And I go, What? He says, I gazing and I go and I’m like, Really? This is what I using in as I yeah, I’ve been doing it for the past two years, you know, during that conversation. But I would love to learn more about, you know, how you guys doing whatever.

Emilio Palafox: And it was the same thing that I described. I think they only do it for 3 minutes. No, actually, I think it might have been five now. I’ve done it for like 10 minutes and 15 minutes. I’d say the longer the better. But let’s say let’s just keep it at the five. All of them, when they were doing it with their patients, all walks of life, all listen, it is ethnicities, just all walks of life, right?

Emilio Palafox: And all different age groups. And when they did that, every single time they broke down, walls broke down and there would be some kind of release. There would be some kind of laughter or crying or shout or there would be something. And over many years, the people there, the staff would collect the feedback, the testimonials, and in summary, when they combine them all, it all came back to always, always, always one thing.

Emilio Palafox: And it was it was the first time in my life that I actually felt seeing. Hmm. And when you look at and study depression and in a lot of that at the core, I’ve heard a lot of people saying that I just want to be seen for myself, for who I am, and for people to love me, for who I am, for everything that I am.

Emilio Palafox: And I think it’s hard these days to be your true, authentic self for lots of reasons. And I think when people can actually see you and I be like, I see you without saying I see you because I think and I think that there’s that exchange. But really cool on the biometrics side of things. So like when you’re doing that, I think it’s like 20 seconds in your heart rate because they shoot them up to all these different biometrics.

Emilio Palafox: So like when you’re doing that, there’s like a certain point, let’s say 20 minute markers, I’m sorry, 22nd mark or something where like both heart sinks, the heart rate variability sinks. 30 seconds later, the breath syncs, the breath syncs up together as one. And like all these things start to sync up between both parties and and it’s just profound as you almost become one.

Emilio Palafox: And seeing that we are each other, we are all this one organism experiencing this life together. And as Ram Dass would say, we’re all just walking each other home and we get to see each other in it in a deeper way. Right? They say that the eyes of the windows to the soul. So I think there’s like all of that, all in one juicy session.

Dean Pohlman: So that with did they did this with the clinical practitioners or this with who are they doing it to. Are they doing the engaging session with So.

Emilio Palafox: I guess it has been done for, for who.

Dean Pohlman: But specifically what we were just talking about, were they doing it. Yeah.

Emilio Palafox: So it was, it was were they doing a mental health. They were just I don’t know if they were doing the legs around the people because these are just like strangers and stuff. And I don’t think they were holding the hands. They were simply they’re strangers sitting down. They’re strangers. Yeah. And I think some of them.

Dean Pohlman: So yeah, that was my.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, some of them. Some of them had relationships. Yes. But there were also a lot of them were strangers as well.

Dean Pohlman: So as you were talking about engaging, you also talk about how that that led to your experience of self love. And I want to you know, we’ve we’ve touched on this already in this conversation, the importance of loving yourself. What does that actually mean and what is the what is the work involved in self-love? Like, what does that look like?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, that’s a great question because I think if everyone can like love themselves, I think humanity would be in a different place. And right before I would answer that, the reason I say that is because if I don’t have love and this is coming from Wayne Dyer, one of my favorite mentors, if I don’t have love, how can I give love?

Emilio Palafox: People often times and that was this person. And I’m picking up a half empty cup here. I was giving, giving, giving, giving, giving love and everything of me, but like it was coming from an empty place, like, but if my cup was overflowing going back to the overflowing cup, then I can give a lot more. Right? And so I feel like, like if I went, I would say like, if I want to give you an orange nine, but I don’t have an orange, how can I how can I give you an orange?

Emilio Palafox: So same thing, right? Like if I don’t have love for myself, how am I going to give that truly and fully? And so along those lines, I think self-love can and I think it’s different for all of us. But I think at the core, some of the things coming up is for me and I think for a lot of men, because I’ve done a lot of men’s work and shadow work and a lot of intensives for many, many, many, many years.

Emilio Palafox: And what I keep hearing is that for men it’s hard for us to ask for help. And I think that’s so important to finally say, like, I can’t do this, I need help. Whether it’s personally, professionally, spiritually, what have you. And in another thing, you know, I often think in terms of physical, mental, emotional, spiritual, financial, how am I feeling those cups up?

Emilio Palafox: Right. And so the way that I would physically. Right. Show myself love is I have this vessel to live in. And as we’re traveling around the world, really, my home is my body is my mind am I doing things that where I’m going to have a strong body, a peaceful mind and a home full of a higher love.

Emilio Palafox: And it’s like, well, there’s discipline that comes into play, right? Like, do I decide to wake up in the morning to watch a sunrise because I get to be with me? God, source universe, whatever you want to call it, and hear nature and see nature and be able to be like, Wow, this is my last day. Like, I get to appreciate and really, like, soak this in and really, like, enjoy the ripples in the water, enjoy the tree dancing in the wind and how beautiful that can be.

Emilio Palafox: And taking time for me to really be at peace with my surroundings and who I am and being able to appreciate that, like taking time for me and being able to then maybe like, you know, do some breathwork, which we love and and to like, see what comes up from that. Because I know that there’s, you know, the body keeps the score.

Emilio Palafox: There could be some emotions trapped in me to Breathwork I think it’s a great way to release some of those things. So if I take time for me to self love, then I choose to want to become a better man. I choose to want to remove that one tool being breathwork. I choose to use that tool to do that because I want to fill in my cup.

Emilio Palafox: I want to experience self-love. Then I’m like, You know what? I want a strong body, so I’m going to be disciplined into working out. However, that looks like it’s different all the time since we travel. But to like, do that and then emotionally practice emotional intelligence, to be able to understand that triggers are gifts. And so when I get trigger like, okay, what are the tools?

Emilio Palafox: What are the things I can do to wow, okay, this hasn’t been healed yet. Let me see what I can do to strengthen that and to have loving kindness for myself. And I think I can stop here and then we can have this conversation. But like I think along this journey, a lot of people beat themselves up. When they make a mistake, they do something like, Dang it, I shouldn’t have done that.

Emilio Palafox: I’m an idiot because we’re the worst self critics. And I think when you do make a mistake to have loving kindness for yourself, to smile, say, There’s me doing it again. So you can be an observer mode and see yourself just doing it again, whatever it is that you’re doing. And then just to welcome any emotions that come up because it’s just data, it’s just energy it’s going to release, but to welcome it, not suppressed it, I hide distract Netflix and chill it, welcome that and I think when I do that, then I’m practicing my mental and emotional muscles.

Emilio Palafox: I’m hitting that category of self-love so that when I do that, I can then heal from that and just be a more at peace, love and joy for all of my relationships. So I digress. But I think those are some of the things that come up when I think about self-love for myself. Mm hmm.

Dean Pohlman: So for so kind of by this definition, we’re thinking about self-love as a self-care in a way. And I want to kind of challenge that because my understanding of I don’t think of what a lot, because I do a lot of things that are self-care and I work out. I can, you know, I go on walks, I go on hikes every now and then.

Dean Pohlman: I, I do sauna, I cold plunge. I don’t know, throwing yourself in a freezing bath is self-love, but.

Emilio Palafox: It’s like, yeah, yeah. Well, I.

Dean Pohlman: Like my kind of thought is like, I don’t know if like, to me that doesn’t mean to me that might be maintenance. Maintenance herself. I don’t know, self maintenance or like self self-help practices, self health practices. But I want to know about like what are some of the well, maybe, maybe I’ll ask it this way. What are some ways that people fill the void of self-love?

Dean Pohlman: Because I think that people can I think specifically men in this conversation, I think we strive to to make ourselves feel worthy of love by doing all of those things that, you know, society subconsciously tells us to do, go get an amazing partner, have a great job, make a lot of money, you know, be in good shape, have a you know, have a family, all of these things.

Dean Pohlman: And I think those are ways that people to me, it seems like that’s those are ways that my people might fill the void of self-love. Right? They may not actually love themselves. They might love all the things that they created for themselves, like the life that created for themselves. But if you if you stripped all of that away, like for me, I’m asking the question, if I stripped away all the things that I have accomplished, like if I took away my my athletic career, if I took away my physical fitness, if I took away what I’ve accomplished with man for yoga, Yeah, what would I love?

Dean Pohlman: Who’s left over And I don’t know if I would like to me, like so much of my who I think of myself as, as like is the accomplishments that I’ve had, not the person underneath all. Does that makes sense.

Emilio Palafox: I love love this conversation. So I’m glad we’re going in this in this direction. And I’m glad that you shared what you shared. So this is this is one of my biggest stories. So I’ll start off by saying a hook point. A lot of the times we used to say we I’m going to say what we used to say and then adjust it.

Emilio Palafox: We say, kill your Superman to find your IT. And in our case, it was, you know, me and my wife talking. So we were like, Till you’re Superman to find your Wonder Woman, because she also plays like heroes in action films and movies. But then, you know, I was like, That’s kind of a little harsh. But like, so then we were like, Lose your Superman to find your Wonder Woman.

Emilio Palafox: And we just said, You know, Superman and Wonder Woman because she’s my Wonder Woman. But like, you could also replace it with, you know, lose your Superman to find peace or love or joy or abundance or what have you. You know, replace that with whatever you choose. But the losing the Superman was was removing this whole process of unbecoming to like if you stripped away everything that you that you just finished talking about what was left right and I often talk about you know growing up I grew up in a domestic violence type household dad very abusive to my mom, physically, mentally, emotionally, a lot of different ways.

Emilio Palafox: And I grew up powerless. You know, I had a lot of anger. I went through this whole hero’s journey, right? My first thing was don’t become my father. And after feeling that it was the next and the next to the next, the reason why I bring this up is because any time that we didn’t feel safe, seen, hurt or loved, any time we had a traumatic experience as such or anything else that you guys have been through, we put on a mask, we build a wall, we become a character.

Emilio Palafox: I had to become a peacemaker to make sure everything was good in the house. I had to make sure that everyone was happy. So I became that character. And like, you end up like, assuming these roles to to, to make you survive that particular situation. But that’s not you. You’re just like, okay, I have to put this mask on.

Emilio Palafox: I to put this character on which are walls. And we do that from beginning to present. And so when I talk about and throughout that process, because I felt so powerless and because of this societal norm of like, you need to have this awesome car, this awesome house, the awesome partner, the the travel, the world, you need to make this much money, you need it, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Emilio Palafox: I went down that route. I used to be an oil and gas financial analyst management, independent consulting, helping oil and gas companies all over the world and their revenue and royalty, accounting and finance is all this kind of stuff. And I had all of that. And yet I was dying inside and I had toxic relationships and toxic environments.

Emilio Palafox: And so but society that I had learned through like men’s health and and all these other magazines and TV and film and subconsciously getting programed like, I needed to talk this way, be this way, this with this thing. And I was Superman, quote unquote, on the surface. Mm hmm. But inside, I was a scared little boy. That still had wounds that needed to be healed.

Emilio Palafox: And I had not recognized that inner boy and loved that inner boy and healed and all this kind of stuff. And so, you know, in short and long story short, I had to go through a process of and this is all the deep in a work and it looks differently to start to identify all my characters, all my masks that I was wearing and start to remove those which is breaking down those walls have you read the.

Dean Pohlman: Have you read The Mask of Masculinity? Have you heard of this book by Louis.

Emilio Palafox: Bird Of that book? Yeah, no, I’ve heard of that book and it’s maybe it’s the same thing, but yeah, yeah, I had to remove all of those matches like, Oh wow, I have this mass. I didn’t always this. I didn’t. Oh, I didn’t. I was this character. And and in the process, by the way, it’s a longer story, but I hit rock bottom after that whole, like ten plus years, oil and gas finance, accounting, consulting, you know, kind of living the high life in a way, but not so much inside.

Emilio Palafox: I had lost everything in my life physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, financially, all my relationships person. I thought I was going to marry friends that I thought were going to last a lifetime move to different, you know, state I’m sorry city at the time and I hit rock bottom for two years. You know I was going to take a sabbatical for a whole year to just like, reset in all the different ways.

Emilio Palafox: But it turned into two years. I took everything out of my savings and just bet on myself. And it was like, you know, it was the whole couch journey. It was I thought it was the shit back then. I had a huge ego and God shut me up hard and that was the best blessing of my entire life.

Emilio Palafox: You know, super humbling to ask just to stay at people’s places, which I thought was going to be a year, but turned into two years for friends and family and and just worked on myself even more. I was like, well I have to look the man in the mirror even more now. I done so much work for so long.

Emilio Palafox: It started in in sixth grade when I didn’t want to become my dad and I found myself in a Barnes Noble’s. But then fast forward, I’m like, Wow, I still am going through stuff. So look in the man in there. More than ever during that two year period and every day, literally like whether it was going to intensives, retreats, reading so many books, reflection, contemplation, having hard conversations because I had messed up so much in a lot of my relationships that I had to finally look the man in the mirror more than ever.

Emilio Palafox: And that deep inner work very simply was finding those masks, those characters loving those characters and masks, because that’s what brought me here. That’s what made me survive. And thanking them and saying, you know, in a in a very like visualizing kind, metaphorically speaking, being like, thank you, but I need to let you go and letting that go and on and on and on and on and on it.

Emilio Palafox: And at the very end of the two year journey, I remember laying down in a park screaming to the heavens, tribute to God being like, What more do you want from me? I can’t do this anymore. And I was shouting at two in the morning at a park next to my sister’s house in Austin, Texas. And I just remember having like the 10,000 release it felt like.

Emilio Palafox: And I was shaking. And at that very point, after all of that, I felt and I was like, nothing. I had lost everything. I was at literally nothing. I just felt like I was like loincloth and like nothing to my name anymore and was like, I can’t do this anymore. And at that moment I had never felt this bliss and this piece that came over me immediately.

Emilio Palafox: And at that point or not at that point, the next day when I woke up, I really finally truly felt like the real Superman, not this fake Superman. It was like, Wow. When I removed all of that, I found out who the real Superman was. And in that nothingness I was, I felt connected to everything. This. I was like, Wow.

Emilio Palafox: Because if it’s just me driving the bus, great. I can only do so much. Well, I let go and let God. And that’s the word I choose. Everyone choose a different word. This higher power. I was I felt if I let go of just me, me, I was like, really tapped into everything. And it was my first time actually experiencing that.

Emilio Palafox: And that was that blissful, peaceful, abundant state. And no lie that very next day when I woke up calls business opportunities. The friend wanted to introduce me to this friend. I started to make more connections, like everything changed when I had truly let go of all of those things and found myself. And so anyway, it’s a longer story, but in short, that’s a lot of how I became to know my true self, if you will.

Emilio Palafox: And and during that time there was a lot of self-love and giving myself a lot of loving kindness for all the mistakes and all the things I went to, just loving that and accepting that and appreciating everything that it was all for me.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. No, I mean, like those those. Thank you though, as a thank you for sharing that. What a profound experience. And this is like this is this is those types of experiences, I think are the ones that are the ones that we really focus on in the Better Man podcast. Honestly, it’s those profound, transformative experiences that are like extremely intense when they happen, but ultimately we come out of them and we’re like, okay, like now things will be better.

Dean Pohlman: And so just to kind of recap, so it sounds like through this two year sabbatical process, through self work, through self-exploration, you these masks that you were wearing, they were protective. So we’re not protective behaviors, but adapt adaptive behaviors or they were protective mechanisms, both.

Emilio Palafox: Of those things. Yeah, Yeah. I mean, it was.

Dean Pohlman: Clicking on the proper phrase right now, but.

Emilio Palafox: It got me protective.

Dean Pohlman: Things that enabled you that you realized like, okay, I had these they’re no longer serving me now I’m going to thank, you know, thank you. Now, as you said, and now I’m going to start, you know, and now I’m going to start practicing my life differently. I’m kind of I mean, I do want to dig into that a little bit.

Dean Pohlman: Sorry I keep on interrupting you, but I kind of want to dig into that like a little bit more and ask what is what were some of those realizations that you went through?

Emilio Palafox: Oh, man, let’s see. There’s so many do three.

Dean Pohlman: Your favorites.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, I’m kind of scanning back now. So during that process, you know, I one things come to mind, I remember joining, I started joining a lot of men’s groups or in that time one of them was called the Mankind Project and we did this warrior weekend. And if you ever study well, I’ll just go here because it’s a longer story.

Emilio Palafox: So Warrior Weekend, it was a 48 hour intensive like physical, mental, emotional, spiritual, not like religious or anything. It’s just like this incredible hero’s journey all packed into like a 48 hour weekend. And it was very intense. And through that time, there was a lot that came up right. I think I wasn’t at that point. I was in an I was not an Integris man.

Emilio Palafox: I didn’t have a lot of accountability. And I had a big ego. It was just all about me. And I would blame a lot of people. I had a lot of anger. I would just react and spew poison on anybody that would trigger me. I just thought it was a shit and it was just all about me. It was like me, me, me, and and also because of the way that I grew up, I had to do everything myself.

Emilio Palafox: And so I never when we were talking about asking for help, like I never asked for, and I was uncomfortable with myself, I wasn’t confident with myself. So everything that I was doing was coming from an insecure place of the things that I said. Like I had things I would say, certain things in certain ways and whatever, whatever to showcase.

Emilio Palafox: Like look at, look, look at me. I got all my shit together, but it was coming from a place of I’m not good enough. And it was for me that was such a big shadow, this thing that I would, you know, the shadow for those that people don’t know. Right. And the things that we hide, suppress and deny from ourselves.

Emilio Palafox: And it was. It was that. And it was a whole lot of things. But that’s such a big core that I didn’t feel good enough also that I didn’t have enough because I grew up poor. So then again, I would just create more mask and things of like, Look, no, I do, I do. I do. Rather than just being like, I don’t need anything.

Emilio Palafox: I just feel that way. And and as simple as that sounds, and maybe it doesn’t, but it’s simple to me now. It’s like I realize that I don’t need anything. Like, I just need me, myself, and I. And I’m. And I am good enough. Like, I realize that, you know, when you when you lose everything and you feel that bliss finally and you’re really tapped into like, because there’s so much noise in our daily life, you’re going through the motions, got to go to work.

Emilio Palafox: You get the kids, you get the family, get to do this. This is that we don’t spend a lot of time just being silent. And I love and I love all religions and all mentalities and everything. But in the Bible it says be still and know that I am God and however you want to replace God or what have you.

Emilio Palafox: I just think when we’re still, we connect with ourselves, connect with a higher power and and in that time I had a lot of time to practice that. And I want everybody to be able to feel aligned and connected to themselves more than ever and not just have all this noise. So a lot of that noise started to get cut off, and when that got cut off, I felt like I finally found myself.

Emilio Palafox: I fully felt myself right. I feel myself. I’m not thinking about that song, but I feel it myself. And when I did, it’s just a simple realization, like there’s nothing to do or to take or a tool. It’s like when you truly let go and remove all that stuff and and be still in practice being still. I think the realization just comes naturally because when you feel it, you’re like, Whoa, I’m powerful.

Emilio Palafox: Like because when you practice, just like anything else, if I practice repping a bicep all the time, over time, that’s, you know, breaking down muscle fibers to get bigger, faster, stronger. If I, if I practice the silence and practice the silence and practice this like non-attachment to things. Hmm. Then what grows from that? That muscle that gets bigger, faster, stronger is that connection with my self and everything else in the world.

Emilio Palafox: And it’s it’s only can be experience. And so when you experience that over and over and over and practice that and rep that you get to a realization like, wow, you it’s just like I am extremely powerful, not in an ego way, just like this beautiful, powerful, incredible person. Why was I always reaching for something else to make me feel this way when it’s it’s always and it’s cliche to say, but it truly is always within you and that I can access at any time.

Emilio Palafox: I think a lot of people are building external things in external like real estate and psych. Why not build the internal real estate where you’re the eye of the storm? I finally felt the eye of the storm in a tornado, right? That that eye of the storm is where it’s peace and calm all the time. I was finally able to build that internal real estate to where I’m like, Oh, wow, I have it is again, cliche, but you get to experience like, wow, I have everything I embrace.

Emilio Palafox: And from that place, the way that you’re vibing at that place, the energy, when you walk into a room in that place, people just feel it and want to be around you. And that’s when, of course, the abundance started to come in. So when I started to let go and just be myself and love myself and be so confident myself, it came from just appreciate in the silence, appreciating just being with me and loving that and learning to love that.

Emilio Palafox: And everything changed from that point that place. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: I’m trying to, I’m trying to understand like what all that looks like, you know, because so part of it’s practicing silence. So what is practicing silence?

Emilio Palafox: So I like to literally go into a closet where it’s pitch black and my senses are all, you know, I’m just like wherever because it’s we’re traveling to find a closet. Close it, set the timer for 5 minutes. I like to go longer, but I know if I say, Oh, I’m going to do it for an hour, for 30 minutes, I won’t do it.

Emilio Palafox: So I say 5 minutes every day and I’ll close the door and just be silent. You know, it could look like meditating. Breath work really helps me. I’m I’m a fan of psilocybin, so micro microdosing with so assignment it can look like doing uncomfortable things as well because I tend to find myself like the reason I find the correlation between like self maintenance, like you talked about in self love is because remember how I said the walls that we have, which are the same thing to me as masks or characters, I feel as men we need to break and there’s beauty in the breakdown.

Emilio Palafox: A lot of these men’s group, it’s kind of like an egg and all the 100 processes to the very end is like slowly cracking the egg until the very end, where the final process fucking cracks you wide open and you finally all the emotions that you trapped in that you never wanted to share and you told we’re not good to share.

Emilio Palafox: Come out and you cry and you scream and you roar and you said, I can’t do this. I need help. And there’s men holding space for you to say, I love you. You’re good enough. You don’t need anything. You know, all these things that that you breathe life into. And I think that’s in my opinion, that’s like God, too.

Emilio Palafox: Like, I think all of that is God to me. And so. Hmm. And so I think also in addition of just silence, everything we talked about is like getting yourself uncomfortable was uncomfortable for me to join like these men’s groups. It was uncomfortable for me to do shadow work. It was uncomfortable for me to, like, get into an ice point.

Emilio Palafox: I think when anything that like, scares you or you’re uncomfortable, right? It’s those areas of growth. Because if an ice plunge breaks you or a hot fire breaks you or a long Iron Man breaks you or, you know, doing a vision quest breaks you like anything that is extremely hard for you physically, mentally, emotionally. Do that because the intention is to break.

Emilio Palafox: And if we can get into a safe space in in group or community where you feel so safe in those processes and if you allow yourself to break, you’re breaking the wall. You’re breaking, breaking.

Dean Pohlman: So breaking is like this feeling that it’s too much. I can’t handle this like I can’t what is like breaking or what is breaking a wall? What does that feel like?

Emilio Palafox: So so we talked about asking for help, right? Like, I don’t need any help. I got this. I can do everything. No, I know you’re trying to help me. You know, I don’t know whether it’s like helping me move or helping me with my relationship problems or helping me with a current mindset. I have whatever Maybe people used to always went out me my life.

Emilio Palafox: Like, I got it, I got it. You know, I’m me. I could do it and take them whatever. There was a Moment in Mankind project where there was this ground called a withholding ground. Is it is it is any man in this room withholding anything? It was after we got through different processes and I raised my hand. And I remember at the time I didn’t want to be seen because I was like felt guilt and shame for a lot of things I had done in my past.

Emilio Palafox: But I remember somehow, like my higher self was like raising my hand for me. And I went in there, remember, kind of like blacking out a little bit because I was so nervous around these 50 men all like up to big things in life, hard center, grounded men. And I wasn’t I wasn’t used to feeling it was uncomfortable because I was used to filling grounded, heart centered men.

Emilio Palafox: And I went in there and I remember saying, I remember I kind of blacked out already, you know what I said? But it was around the lines of like, I can’t do this anymore, you know? And remember coming back to and I remember like in a snake, like fashion, all the men were coiled around me and I was in the center and they were all holding hands like this.

Emilio Palafox: And they were all looking at me. And it was like, so frightening because I was finally being seen and I didn’t want to be seen, but I did want to be seen. But I didn’t want to be seen. Right. And my wall of like, Hey, nothing’s wrong with me. I’m totally fine, dude. What do you mean, what are you doing this for guys like, I’m totally good.

Emilio Palafox: I started to crack and crack and crack because I had never seen so much love. In love was the thing that allowed me to break in, like, Oh, my God, what is this? What’s happening? What’s happening? And I broke down and started bawling. I started crying profusely and that wall of me crying and finally, like, just breaking down, like guys I’m weak and I can’t do this and I don’t know what I’m doing.

Emilio Palafox: I’m lost. Allowed me to, like, just be seen. Like, that’s that’s what I’m experiencing right now, guys. And they are so and they’re like, I love you and I see you and I’m here with you and I want to help you contact me tomorrow. I’m going to share this with you. And it was like there was no transaction.

Emilio Palafox: It was just like your whole and I love you and you don’t need to do anything. And it was like, What? And I’m breaking down and my wall is no longer there of, Hey, I’m totally fine. I’m not fine. And that wall shattered and I was finally allowed to let love in because I think a lot of us don’t let love in.

Emilio Palafox: And the trajectory of your life will literally change by the amount of love you decide to let in. And when I allowed that love to pour inside of me and to actually receive it because a lot of us don’t know how to receive. Mm hmm. That we started to fill the cup a whole lot more. It was that was like love juice just pouring into me.

Emilio Palafox: I finally was able to receive that and that wall broke down. It was on to the next and on to the next. So hopefully that was an example to shed some.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah. Wow. I mean, it sounds like a amazingly powerful experience. And I want to tie this back in to our original the start of our conversation. What did self love going through this process and being able to love yourself do for your relationship to when you did find a relationship?

Emilio Palafox: Oh man, everything and everything. So, you know, I no longer was trying to impress dates. I was no longer trying to impress my now partner or anything like that. And, and I’m going to maybe change that word, but it wasn’t like, like let me say the right thing and do the right thing, and I’m in my head. Okay?

Emilio Palafox: This is what I got to do. This way. I going to be this is what I going to do. And I’m like in my head, here’s the thing. If we’re in our heads, we’re not in the present moment. Literally, like if I’m up here thinking, then I’m not here being. And so I was no longer in the headspace.

Emilio Palafox: I was in the heart space. I was just like, I’m just loving my life. I’m just like, I’m just loving my life. Finally, I’m loving me. So then when I operate in the world, I didn’t have an agenda I wasn’t trying to like, do ahead. I would always try to plan things out because I’m going to do this with the judgment papers.

Emilio Palafox: And I wasn’t experiencing life because it was in my head. It was it wasn’t here. And when I was just here, living, loving, I was confident with myself. Finally, I love to. I who I was finding, I was at peace within myself. I had joy. I was actually starting to do the things I love that was like surfing, which I love.

Emilio Palafox: I was like hiking more being in nature, which I love. I was actually like spending time and prioritizing friendships and family time. Even though I had work, I was like, You know what? Sit down and have a cup of tea, which my mom loves. And just like looking at her wrinkles and studying them because who knows if she’s not going to be here tomorrow.

Emilio Palafox: And I’m just like, I’m, I’m, I’m just loving every moment. I’m loving this right, with you doing, like, being here. Right. And and from that place it I think it allowed dates and partners to be like, Whoa, what is this? Like? We were both in this, like, now nest in there. And it was like, Man, who are you?

Emilio Palafox: Like, what is It was like this powerful presence of like, it didn’t matter. It having expectations. I didn’t have any attachments because if I expect to happen and be happens, I created my own suffering. If I had an attachment, I would really want this to go well. And it didn’t create amount suffering. I was just like, Let’s have some fun.

Emilio Palafox: What’s happening? Are you want for this? You want to do that? If it was a no great if she didn’t understand me, if there was a trigger there or whatever, it wasn’t for me. It was a great filtration process. I’m like, Great, no worries. Because yeah, and I’ll say this.

Dean Pohlman: It was like one 100% authentic confidence.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, it was. I finally felt and this is a quote which summarizes what I used to do. Well, I’ll just say the quote and I’m going to try to chop it up. I forget who said it, but something like don’t try to, be someone else so that people will like you, Be yourself and the right people will love you.

Emilio Palafox: Mm hmm. And The right people started to show up rather than continuously being this fake Superman and attracting all these people that really just liked me but really didn’t love me because that’s why I was attracting. I was attracting me. You attract yourself, you see you. You see who you are in life. And and so I started to just love myself so much and vibe it that self that like it was a great filtration process for people that weren’t needed to be in my life.

Emilio Palafox: And it brought all the people that should be in my life. And so Mike, my wife now, when we started dating, it was like I just was like, like, what’s going on? I was like into her. I had compassion with certain things that she said. I was just listening. I was truly listening. If she said something, you say this, which is really cool because I love saying this term that you to you said during the conversation was like, Thank you so much for sharing.

Emilio Palafox: That must have been hard for you to share. And it was she was just kind of like, who the heck is this man? It just did It. I was just like, I was just comfort myself. Like you said it best. And I think I just and I was just a kid. I allowed my kid self to come and play, which allowed herself self to come into play.

Emilio Palafox: We were just like playing together. And I think that’s also part of the higher love coming back. I think all of us are just like kids in big bodies wanting to play and enjoy this frickin life that we have. And when you can be that person, you allow the other person to shine, right? To be that same person to.

Emilio Palafox: Hmm.

Dean Pohlman: Wow. Yeah. I mean, I’m just trying to empathize with, like, this idea of living life like, in the present. Totally. And, yeah, it sounds like a it sounds like an amazing experience. I don’t want to say like, I do that all the time. I don’t want to say that I do that. Like most of the time. I think I think I experience that sometimes and I think, you know, we’re all working toward being I think we all understand that the the need to be more present and to be more aligned.

Dean Pohlman: Our actions align with who we truly are. And, you know, having these conversations is helpful because we we get to understand some of the processes that get us to that point because it is a process. I mean, for is like, holy crap, you know this to your transformative break down screaming at the sky process in the middle of the night at your sister’s house.

Emilio Palafox: So the last night. Yeah, well, not the last scream, I guess it’s almost. And I’m glad that you said what you just said right there, because the same for me. Even though I’ve been saying relationships for a long time. But I’m a student for life. You know, we keep mentioning the cup, but I forget who said this too.

Emilio Palafox: But like a beginner’s mind, like the more I know a lot about relationships, the more I know that I know nothing. And I will continuously empty my cup in any conversation so that I can be able to fill it up. Right. It’s that whole thing like my cup is full. How can I receive anything? And I want to be able to always empty it and to learn from everybody.

Emilio Palafox: I feel like we’re all walking each other home and I. I do my best to practice what I just said. But. And I think I do very well at it. I’ll give myself some loving kindness of, like, all the work that I’ve done. I think I do well at it, but I absolutely are times where I’m not well at it.

Emilio Palafox: But I think the work allows us to catch it faster. So they’re like, Oh, that’s my goal, that sort of way. Oh, here it comes up again. Look at that. Isn’t that interesting? And I can throw it away faster rather than be in it and not know that I’m in it. And so I think that’s kind of part of the work.

Emilio Palafox: We have more of a decision point, the light shining so bright as to what you’re doing. You’re like, Oh, hey, okay, now let’s push that aside and let’s get back to where I was. So I’m not perfect and I am definitely suited for one. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: I’m I’m really interested to hear your, your, your answers to these to this part. Two questions.

Emilio Palafox: So what’s.

Dean Pohlman: Let’s get in these. You’re ready?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, Let’s do it. Okay.

Dean Pohlman: What do you think is one habit, belief or mindset that has helped you? The in terms of your overall happiness moments.

Emilio Palafox: Mindset habit? Yeah, that it’s kind of twofold. It said I need nothing that when I tap into the nothingness, this is the mindset that I really experience everything. So when I get caught up, I go back to that calm center of like just, just letting go of everything. Just just being myself. Like we’re human beings for a reason.

Emilio Palafox: We’re being just like, is to be with myself. Mm hmm. Because in the present, there is no fear, anxiety, guilt, shame, what have you. It’s just. And I think the more that I continue to just align and just breathe and just be with that, like to be in that nothing ness into practice and rep to be in that nothingness.

Emilio Palafox: That’s when I, in a weird way, connect to everything ness and that like that. Everything in that state, everything is is beautiful, peaceful and blissful. It’s you, you realize in that moment, like, wow, everything is happening for me. And the reason why I wanted it to be twofold is every time I get triggered, I realize it’s an opportunity to look and go back within, to contemplate and to reflect and to journal these things so that I can get back to center.

Emilio Palafox: And so those triggers, when I do get triggered, it’s a reminder to go within. And I’m happy when that happens. And it’s I think when I have that kind of habit or I get triggered, let’s go within let’s get back to that piece of shit to it. And I think it’s because I know in that place I’m going to feel good again.

Emilio Palafox: It’s almost like when you’re sick, you’re in a different state of consciousness, like everything feels hard, I can’t do it. And all of sudden you can bet you’re like, Oh wait, I can’t do this. Everything’s fine. I mean, these amazing. I think that habit of getting triggered allows me to go back in because I know everything is a cycle.

Emilio Palafox: Okay? But I’m not there yet. It’s like being at the basement of a elevator and I’m like, okay, go back in, get so I can go back to the 50th floor where I know my state of conscious. It’s going to be like, everything’s freaking beautiful and everything’s happening for me.

Dean Pohlman: Cool. All right. What’s one thing that you do for your health that you believe is overlooked or undervalued by others?

Emilio Palafox: These are great questions, man. Oh, that’s a great question for my health. I can look physically, mentally, emotionally, man.

Dean Pohlman: It can be any of those things.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, right. Oh, wow. It’s like, what’s the one thing I want to share? Because there’s so many I want to try to say something different that maybe a lot of things people haven’t said in the quote. Let’s say the quote from one day we mentioned our earlier. One of the quotes I love from him is when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change.

Emilio Palafox: And so maybe taking a moment to be like, let me look at you. How can I look at you differently? How can I look? My partner differently? How can I look strange or differently? How can I look at the tree differently? Or the way that the sun dances on the water? Like, how can I see this bird coming up to me?

Emilio Palafox: How can I see this differently? So that again, when I change the way I look at things, the things I look at change and really deeper, it’s almost like your external reality is literally a reflection of your internal reality being reflected. So when I have that different perspective change about something, that simple thing allows me to view the world completely different.

Emilio Palafox: And when that’s the case, I show up differently.

Emilio Palafox: And then my health, I’m in more of more and more and more in a peaceful, joyful, happy place because of that pivot in the way that I looked at something. Mm hmm.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, that’s a very similar idea to that is the very popular, stoic idea that we create suffering based on our perception of things that are neither good. They’re neither bad. We create suffering based on our interpretation of, of, of the event. So love that. Yeah. Yeah.

Emilio Palafox: It’s the what’s it’s like what’s the quote? Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional because of what you just said. Yeah, for sure.

Dean Pohlman: Third question What’s the most important activity you regularly do for your overall stress management issues?

Emilio Palafox: Something different than the times we talked about. And I know this podcast has talked about a lot of the things, you know, the sign of the cold tub, the breath work and all this kind of stuff. I love all of those things and those helped greatly, but maybe it’s shading something different. What’s what’s one thing that I do?

Emilio Palafox: Can you say that again?

Dean Pohlman: To say the most important activity or one activity that you regularly do for your overall stress management?

Emilio Palafox: There’s so many. Again, I just want to pick something kind of different that I do that maybe kind of shed a different light for stress management. And I know we didn’t talk about breath work, but I’m such a big fan of breath work. I mean, I’m such a big fan of breath work. I just got to say that there’s a lot of different things, but I don’t I think I just wish the whole world would utilize their breath in a lot of ways.

Emilio Palafox: I like breath, work, detox whole or tropic breath work, and I try to do that, especially if I’m stressed. I know that that’s going to 100% fix it. I’ll just put it go on Spotify, put some great music on like some spiritual music and and I’ll try to breathe for at least 5 minutes. I try to really go into the 1530 minute range of it’s ideal.

Emilio Palafox: It’s a whole hour of like this nonstop. You know, you breathe through the lower belly, then the then the upper chest heart area and then a complete release. So it’s like an inhale, inhale, exhale. And it’s very intense breath work, obviously called breath work for a reason that will just disseminate any kind of stress. Another way of just getting completely centered and balanced for me.

Emilio Palafox: Me and my wife also love to do it together because then we like to share what happened during those experiences and connect deeper together. So I think breathing together really allows us to connect together not only for each other, but ourselves as well. And it really connects me back to God. So I think I’m just going to have to say that because I want that to be just shout to the rooftops for humanity.

Emilio Palafox: I feel like if everyone did that, things would be different. Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: No, I think that’s an awesome answer. I don’t think people have said before so and I think, yeah, breathing is yeah. Like I don’t like I don’t typically like having I don’t like having art in my house that looks like it was purchased at HomeGoods. But there’s like, we have this one thing, it’s like a little wooden sign that’s like perches up on a, on like a buffet table or like a TV stand.

Dean Pohlman: It says just breathe. And I’m like, Fine, I’ll keep it.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah, that reminds totally. It’s a little the simplest things are the best things, and we know it all already. It’s just about like, just practicing it, right, and practicing what we preach, all of that stuff. So yeah, I think, I think the breath people have said it a lot maybe, and maybe not on this podcast, but I think like anything, anything breath it when we’re like even evolving and when we’re in an uncomfortable position, in an uncomfortable situation, in a relationship, we want to get to our head about like, what can I say here?

Emilio Palafox: What can I do here? But literally the best thing to do is just like, breathe through it, like breathe through the uncomfortableness. Because when you’re breathing, integrating that new level of yourself, you know? So I love that you brought that up. Just breathe. Yeah, It’s like Nike, right? Just. Just do it. Just breathe. Right.

Dean Pohlman: All right. Related to stress, what’s the most stressful part of your day to day life?

Emilio Palafox: The stressful part of my day to day life. I would say two things. Sometimes I can have this paralysis by analysis where I’m analyzing all the different things I got to do you know, I got like, you know, the coaching, the speaking that I get to manage this over here, put on this, have put on the administrative world, do some marketing, do some clothes, just some speaking engagements are all these.

Emilio Palafox: So we’ve got a retreat coming up and Oh my God, Oh my God, Oh my God. And I’m like, I don’t know where to start. And obviously it’s just one step, right? So I think when I when I get overwhelmed with, all the things I have to do because I’m in my head again, then I can just and that can happen at any point in time.

Emilio Palafox: Right? So I think when I and when I had this mindset of like at the end of the day, I often remind myself of death, you brought stoicism into this. Me and my wife think about this a lot because then I’m like, You know what? The end of the day, none of this matters. Like, if I die tomorrow, I can’t take all this stuff.

Emilio Palafox: Like, okay, I’m worried about, you know, like Brendon or Chard or even in longevity studies. It’s like most people at the very end of their deathbed wish they would have lived more loved or mattered more, period. They’re more important than we’re happy and think about the strength of their and relationships all the time. You heard 10,000 times and there’s lots of studies on this.

Emilio Palafox: So then I remind myself that I’m like, Man, none of this matters. So I’m like, So then that gets me like, okay, I’m good to take step one, right? And so so that’s that can be very stressful. And then also, I’m trying to get rid of this story that every time my dad or my mom calls me or my sister, that something could be wrong, that I might get that call, that something happened.

Emilio Palafox: And it comes from just the way that I grew up. I’m trying to change that story in my head, but every time that that calls or something’s going on, there could be family issues going on that stresses me just because I love my family so much and I want my family to be happy, peaceful, joyful. I want them to have some of the tools that I’ve acquired, not that it has to be the same tools for them, but like we’re all in different journeys and.

Emilio Palafox: I care so much, so I have to practice that non-attachment. But those can be stressful for me with family or my wife or my loved ones. Along with the paralysis by analysis. Mm hmm.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, That’s a good that’s a those are valid answers. My last question here is what do you think is the biggest challenge facing men and their well-being right now?

Emilio Palafox: The biggest challenge with men in their wellbeing? I mean, it’s a whole slew of things. I don’t tend to focus. I believe right now society, there’s a big part of society that’s saying that like we don’t need men anymore and that there’s like this toxic masculinity, which there is toxic masculinity, but like that I just feel like there’s the divine masculine and there’s this divine feminine, like there’s just divine human beings.

Emilio Palafox: We’re connected to the divine in a way. I love that, you know, however you want to say it for me, I say, you know, God is divine. We are the branches. I guess it’s all one branch. I don’t think of it as like like my hand is not just my hand. My hand is a part of me, but it’s my hand.

Emilio Palafox: But it’s also like my cells are also part of me, but they’re living their own life inside right? Like my bacteria is me. But it’s also like they’re doing their own thing there. But it’s we’re all this one. I’m all this one organism contributed bones and tissues and muscles and cells and all this kind of stuff. It’s all one.

Emilio Palafox: And I think that So that’s what I mean about like this divine, masculine, divine feminine, Divine human is divine humanness that we are spirit that we are. And I think I think we’re I think we’re forgetting that at the foundation of this answer. I think we’re going so much to technology now, to A.I., into the robotics, to automation, to like all these things.

Emilio Palafox: And I think this like trend, like this, this technological advance is incredible. An amazing helps me with my business and stuff, but I think gets us away to like this divinity. And I think so it’s not only with men, I think it’s with everything. And so I’ll just start there and then, you know, you always hear it’s just that men can’t share their emotions that can’t cry.

Emilio Palafox: They can’t scream, that they can’t release, they can’t share that can’t say I love you to a man to say I love you to another human. I think I think I think those are some of the things that are plaguing us right now that, you know, if we don’t if men don’t allow themselves to heal their childhood traumas, then they’re going to show up and all of their relationships over and over and over again.

Emilio Palafox: And if we can’t hold a safe space for each other to allow us to break a safe space and say, Brother, we’re all in the same boat here. We’re all we’re all walking each other home. Like, how can I learned from you? How can I help you? How can I just create a space for you to feel safe, seen, heard and loved?

Emilio Palafox: I think right now it’s man, it’s just like about it’s a societal norm. The societal norms, like, let’s fix things, let’s do things. That’s just be men and whatever that looks like. And it’s like, we’re so much more than that. We all are. And I think if we can just be present, find our purpose and get our power back from all the times that it hasn’t, that we’ve lost our power.

Emilio Palafox: If we can be with people creating good connection and community with people that love us because we’re being authentic selves, and if we can be prepared for life’s inevitable waves because my favorite quote is There’s life is like the ocean, there’s always going to be waves. The good news is that you can learn how to surf. So if we can be prepared, probably in all the ways you talk about on this podcast, I think with presence, with purpose, with power, with people, with preparation, I think we can all with men, help each other, showcase true authentic selves and shine bright to be vulnerable.

Emilio Palafox: That vulnerability is a strength where I think a lot of conversations to be had like this. But I think it can. I think it just needs to be talked about this over and over and over, and that we as men need to rep this and rep this, rep this so that the the higher love, that higher state of consciousness we talked about in the very beginning.

Emilio Palafox: Is it that is the norm that this is what all of us men do. Yeah. And that and that that that men sharp that good men sharp and good men and and that we need each other to like to to create some friction like. Hey, hey, brother. I feel that you were out of accountability or integrity or whatever, or maybe challenging each other.

Emilio Palafox: Oh wow. And being able to like men. Good men. Sharp and good men. Okay, well, how can we help each other grow? And so I think I think it’s just all of that in one. Right. I don’t I think all of that needs to be talked about. I think it’s just as men, how can we just truly showcase both the boat and the ocean?

Emilio Palafox: How can we just showcase this is all of us and more and being safe to do that?

Dean Pohlman: Yeah, that’s an answer.

Emilio Palafox: That I love a lot.

Dean Pohlman: To unpack. Well, yeah, I think you brought a lot of great points ultimately. Yeah. This idea that we need to normalize vulnerability in men and these. Yeah, these other expressions of of of men and masculinity instead of the ones that are the, the ones that are most prevalent put forward.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah. And being comfortable to share whatever because I think everyone has something to share and a story to share. And if we can just be the love and seek to understand each other. Mm. I think that will go far from the things that are plaguing us that we talked about. Yeah. Who.

Dean Pohlman: All right. Lot to unpack there. Might have to listen to that again, but what’s the best way for people to. First off, I want to say thank you for going to all the places that you did with me. I’m interested in trying eye gazing. I’m looking forward to seeking out some more men’s groups. I think that can be beneficial for a lot of reasons.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah.

Dean Pohlman: So yeah, I’m excited for a lot of what we discuss. And what’s the what are the best ways that people can kind of keep up with what you’re doing.

Emilio Palafox: Yeah. So you can go to simply relationship you know w WW dot relationship renegades dot com and you’ll see everything about us here on social media we’re on all platforms I’m also on Instagram a lot. So people want to just see the behind the scenes stuff of everything going on. My first name and last name so it’s Emilio Underscore Palafox Underscore and there you’ll find relationship, you know, at relationship dot renegades which is on the co-founder of with me and my wife.

Emilio Palafox: But yeah even if you Google that you’ll find it so yeah that’s really cool.

Dean Pohlman: Yeah that sounds like a great way that that couples can do some of the work that we talked about in this episode and it’s.

Emilio Palafox: Touches couples by the way it’s just it’s it’s.

Dean Pohlman: Not.

Emilio Palafox: Okay yeah it’s just we’re just that proactive approach to peaceful, playful and fully alive relationships. So we have a lot of singles coming in because they want to be prepared and fill up their cup for the next relationship, or if they’re really good, to help enhance that. Yeah, so it’s just a proactive way for proactive of our fitness and health.

Emilio Palafox: Why not be proactive about our relationships? Sweet. Okay, cool.

Dean Pohlman: If people are listening and they’re interested, can we do a you do a special deal for people listening in?

Emilio Palafox: Yeah. You know, normally we do 15% off some things we do, but I’m just like, you know what? We’re always finding ways of how we can help and serve much more. And just the more people that have our stuff or anybody stuff to, to learn and to grow together better. So I would love to do like a 25% off.

Emilio Palafox: We can talk a lot of code, but maybe put a link into the comments for we have.

Dean Pohlman: We’ll figure out the logistics later. Just check the description and and click something and type something and.

Emilio Palafox: We can do something special for like a retreat coming up that we got in Costa Rica in September and we could do something special for the higher level online program we have.

Dean Pohlman: Cool. It’s awesome. Thank you very much. You’re welcome. All right, man. Amelia, thanks so much for sharing all that. A lot of really powerful personal stories from there. Hopefully some great information that can help you guys listening. Thanks again, man. I hope you’re listening. I hope this inspires you to be a better man. And I’ll see you guys in the next episode.

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